Non Gators...

[gatoraus]

I was just curious what your thoughts were on Matt Ryan's performance tonight and how it affects the Heisman race. Personally, I thought it was less than impressive. He did make one good throw and fortunately for him, that was all they needed. I know some will say he deserves it because he was clutch, but I don't think he is the best QB. I still think that Tebow is the better Quarterback but my opinion is biased so I was curious to hear non-Gators thoughts. Gators, feel free to post as well, just try not to be bias.:thumpsup:

[D^3]

Tebow may be the better quarterback but Matt Ryan will get the respect because he led the team back in a clutch situation, where Tebow has not been able to lead the team from behind yet.

[Roscoe]

He looks slow... I think he was lucky VT's D-line was worn out from not getting a break at the end. But he did start to shine when he took over the play calling during the two 2 min. offense series... I still like Tebow better.

And besides, clutch? It's VT for goodness sakes.

[Tider27]

I like Ryan for the heisman.

[GatorHunter]

Tebow may be the better quarterback but Matt Ryan will get the respect because he led the team back in a clutch situation, where Tebow has not been able to lead the team from behind yet.

We were "behind" vs UK...and Tebow led us back...like 5 times...in Lexington.

However, I really can't make a judgment because I've yet to see Ryan play...didn't watch tonight's game. But BC is a joke. Well, maybe not a joke, but that team is 8-4 in the SEC. Let Ryan go up against the Nations #1 defense and we'll see.

I have to say...I'm not "campaigning" for Tebow. I think he's been just as impressive as any other player in CFB as of right now...but it's still early. He hasn't made the sophomore mistakes that I expected in a first-year starter...we've lost 2 games because we have a very young defense...as another Gator poster put it...we've lost "in spite" of Tebow...not because he didn't perform.

[oxfordreb]

I still say tebow, ryan has arm, tebow has arm AND legs. Would you rather have 1 dollar in your pocket or 2???

[gatoraus]

He looks slow... I think he was lucky VT's D-line was worn out from not getting a break at the end. But he did start to shine when he took over the play calling during the two 2 min. offense series... I still like Tebow better.

And besides, clutch? It's VT for goodness sakes.

That is what I was thinking. BC was lucky they scored at all that game. All I could think about was how overrated they were for losing to a team LSU hung 48 on. I am glad they won though because I know they will slip up down the road. They still have to play at maryland, at Clemson, FSU, and Miami. Oh, and the ACC championship game. All though none of these teams have been dominant, no way they run the table.

[D^3]

C'mon GatorHunter... there were 2 games this season were Florida needed to execute a 2-minute drill if they wanted to win the game and Tebow hasn't been able to do it. I still think Tebow is a better QB than Matt Ryan, but the kind of last-minute magic that Ryan pulled tonight is what gets the Heisman voters' attention.

[gatoraus]

C'mon GatorHunter... there were 2 games this season were Florida needed to execute a 2-minute drill if they wanted to win the game and Tebow hasn't been able to do it. I still think Tebow is a better QB than Matt Ryan, but the kind of last-minute magic that Ryan pulled tonight is what gets the Heisman voters' attention.

Actually, Tebow was given one minute to score a TD on the best defense in the land. Not to mention that that they only had one time out. As far as Auburn goes, Tebow wasn't given a chance. He marched down field and scored to tie it up. Auburn had the ball last and milked the clock down and ended up kicking the game winner. They did touch the ball once after they tied it late and Percy Harvin blew it running backwards on a screen and losing 7 yards. It makes it a lot tougher when it is 2nd and 17. We ran the ball on the next play so I don't see how Tebow was given a chance. Auburn just did what they needed to do, which was milk the clock and kick a clutch field goal.

[oxfordreb]

C'mon GatorHunter... there were 2 games this season were Florida needed to execute a 2-minute drill if they wanted to win the game and Tebow hasn't been able to do it. I still think Tebow is a better QB than Matt Ryan, but the kind of last-minute magic that Ryan pulled tonight is what gets the Heisman voters' attention.


I think it does get the voters attention, but it will wear off before the voting starts. He did do good in the clutch tonight, but unless he can do that a couple of more times and become known a clutch player, it really won't matter. In the end, it will all come down to other things like strength of schedule, consistency, leadership, big numbers, etc. Tonights game isn't going to win him the Heisman, he has to finish the season strong and impressively to get it.

But, i'm not a voter so what do i know, right? :biggrin:

[Roscoe]

They still have to play at maryland, at Clemson, FSU, and Miami. Oh, and the ACC championship game. All though none of these teams have been dominant, no way they run the table.

I wish VT would have pulled it out, it'd help us (not just getting to #2 effortlessly), but for VT to have another win.

I didn't know BC had all those games left. There's no way they're going undefeated. No way.

[GatorNation]

Who knows about the Heisman race....but I didn't think Ryan helped himself. Anyone who watched the game will know he didn't play well at all. Many voters, though, will probably only catch the last pass in the endzone to save the game.

That said, the weather was pretty bad. I would think Ryan would have had a better game without the monsoon, but who knows....

[raptorcox]

Ryan had a bad game, like all players do, but the last 2 drives he proved his merit.

I definetly think he is better than Tebow and on par with Woodson.

[GatorHunter]

C'mon GatorHunter... there were 2 games this season were Florida needed to execute a 2-minute drill if they wanted to win the game and Tebow hasn't been able to do it. I still think Tebow is a better QB than Matt Ryan, but the kind of last-minute magic that Ryan pulled tonight is what gets the Heisman voters' attention.

Huhhh what?

Tebow had less than a minute to drive 80 yds vs LSU...and made it past mid-field...if our coaches hadn't pissed away 30 seconds...who knows?

And vs Auburn...as the other Gator said...our OC sucked it up that game...ran 3 running plays and punted....but we had the lead at the time. The Gators only had 3 offensive possessions in the 4th quarter of that game anyway.

What about Ole Miss? Our OC had a terrible game plan...but Tebow rushed for 170 yds...basically put the team on his back and won the game.

Again, I really don't care about the Heisman right now...we gotta beat UGA, Vandy and SC...that's what I'm worried about. I don't think there's a "dominant" player right now...probably the reason Tebow is getting so much attention. He's a good or better than any player in the Nation...and should be considered, but as I said...he's a sophomore and most expected him to have a bad game or two this season...he hasn't yet...but the season isn't over.

[nooneLT]

I still say tebow, ryan has arm, tebow has arm AND legs. Would you rather have 1 dollar in your pocket or 2???

i would rather have a QB with brains actually. and to me, at least, Ryan shows he's one of the smartest QB's in college football.

[roosterbooster]

That was really the first time I have seen Ryan for a full game this year. From watching Tebow this year I would say on that last play he would have run the ball and had to rely on an iffy field goal kicker. If I were putting together a team with solid receivers, a good line, and good backs to make a run this year I would want Ryan as my QB. If I were putting together a team that had some weaknesses in those areas I would want Tebow as my QB.

Here is where Ryan impressed me last night. He is rather slow, but on those last 2 drives without very solid protection he managed to buy enough time to move his team down the field. He protected the football and threw 2 beautiful balls on those last 2 drives that most NCAA QB's (my view of this may be skewed from watching Gamecock QB's this year) would need 5 tries to make the throws he did under pressure.

I don't think he has anywhere near the supporting cast Tebow does. On the same token he does not play the same caliber competition Tebow does on a week in week out basis. I really think if I had a vote for the best QB between the 2 it would go to Ryan right now. I have seen Tebow make a few ill advised throws in critical situations, most of them he got away with. He has the potential once he matures in his decision making to be much better than Ryan

[WayzUp]

I wasn't and haven't been too impressed with Ryan. He's done a lot with little but a lot of his success has come against inferior competition. We'll see how he fares against the stronger (though still average to below average) teams at the bottom of their schedule. I don't think there's any question Tebow is the better of the two though he needs to finish strong himself before we crown him too soon.

There's a lot of football to be played yet....far too much to narrow it down to just two guys, IMO.

[GatorNation]

That was really the first time I have seen Ryan for a full game this year. From watching Tebow this year I would say on that last play he would have run the ball and had to rely on an iffy field goal kicker. If I were putting together a team with solid receivers, a good line, and good backs to make a run this year I would want Ryan as my QB. If I were putting together a team that had some weaknesses in those areas I would want Tebow as my QB.

Here is where Ryan impressed me last night. He is rather slow, but on those last 2 drives without very solid protection he managed to buy enough time to move his team down the field. He protected the football and threw 2 beautiful balls on those last 2 drives that most NCAA QB's (my view of this may be skewed from watching Gamecock QB's this year) would need 5 tries to make the throws he did under pressure.

I don't think he has anywhere near the supporting cast Tebow does. On the same token he does not play the same caliber competition Tebow does on a week in week out basis. I really think if I had a vote for the best QB between the 2 it would go to Ryan right now. I have seen Tebow make a few ill advised throws in critical situations, most of them he got away with. He has the potential once he matures in his decision making to be much better than Ryan


Ryan does throw a very nice ball...

[WarEagle73]

I don't think it's fair to Ryan to compare him to Tebow. That is like comparing a beige and primer 1989 Grand Am w/ a 4 cylinder to a mint 1969 Mustang Fast Back w/ a 351 Windsor. He is a good QB and all, but he is not in the same league as Tebow. He is a fifth year senior (I think) and Tebow is only a sophomore and already Tebow is a better QB. I hate to say it though, I think the national media will favor Ryan over Tebow due to the fact he is from the northeast (most journalists hail from there), they usually favor upperclassmen over underclassmen, and Tebow is in the SEC. There is a good deal of resentment & envy towards he SEC in the media world. That will hurt Tebow with some voters. :thumbsdow

[nooneLT]

I don't think it's fair to Ryan to compare him to Tebow. That is like comparing a beige and primer 1989 Grand Am w/ a 4 cylinder to a mint 1969 Mustang Fast Back w/ a 351 Windsor. He is a good QB and all, but he is not in the same league as Tebow. He is a fifth year senior (I think) and Tebow is only a sophomore and already Tebow is a better QB. I hate to say it though, I think the national media will favor Ryan over Tebow due to the fact he is from the northeast (most journalists hail from there), they usually favor upperclassmen over underclassmen, and Tebow is in the SEC. There is a good deal of resentment & envy towards he SEC in the media world. That will hurt Tebow with some voters. :thumbsdow

if you're comparing athletic ability, it's no contest. but if you're asking who's better at leading their teams? it's a lot closer, but i'd have to give the advantage to Ryan. i think he makes smarter decisions than Tebow, which is to be expected since he's a senior and Tebow is a sophomore. Tebow gets bailed out by his freakish athletic ability

[D^3]

I don't think it's fair to Ryan to compare him to Tebow. That is like comparing a beige and primer 1989 Grand Am w/ a 4 cylinder to a mint 1969 Mustang Fast Back w/ a 351 Windsor.

More like comparing a 4wd pickup truck with a 9 second track car.

It's apples and oranges really, Matt Ryan is a traditional QB, Tebow is a running QB. Ryan is by far a better passing QB than Tebow, but Tebow is more versatile. What it's going to come down to is which QB wins more games for their team, and right now BC is undefeated, while Florida is about to lose their 3rd game. :thumpsup:

[GatorBait15]

The only reason they won is because VT couldnt put points on the board..vt dominated ryan they got lucky that they were only down 10 0 in the last minutes of the game.... just imagine if that was bc lsu it would have ben 40 0

[Gator2753]

More like comparing a 4wd pickup truck with a 9 second track car.

It's apples and oranges really, Matt Ryan is a traditional QB, Tebow is a running QB. Ryan is by far a better passing QB than Tebow, but Tebow is more versatile. What it's going to come down to is which QB wins more games for their team, and right now BC is undefeated, while Florida is about to lose their 3rd game. :thumpsup:

Just curious...You don't think Tebow is a good passing QB? He seems fairly accurate to me. I won't say the most accurate out there but he is certainly amongst them IMO. I think that b/c UF runs the ball so much( wheather it be Tebow, Moore, Harvin, etc.) that takes away from the number of pass attempts that Tebow could throw if we ran a more traditional style offense. My point is that when Tebow does throw the ball, its usually right on. Ive seem him go deep a number of times this year with good success. Ive seen the ball bounce of WR's chest and hands a number of times. He rarley throws a bad ball.
He has 17 passing TD's compared to 10 on the ground.

Not trying to start anything negative with you, just curious of your opinion and the reasons why. You seem like a pretty cool guy. Together, you and I will be begging the red cross for bottles of water in the next 2 months.:laugh:

[gatoraus]

More like comparing a 4wd pickup truck with a 9 second track car.

It's apples and oranges really, Matt Ryan is a traditional QB, Tebow is a running QB. Ryan is by far a better passing QB than Tebow, but Tebow is more versatile. What it's going to come down to is which QB wins more games for their team, and right now BC is undefeated, while Florida is about to lose their 3rd game. :thumpsup:

I don't get why just because Tebow can run, everyone assumes he isn't as good at passing the ball.

Comp % TDs Ints QB rating
Tebow's stats-66 17 3 177.48 :thumpsup:
Ryan's stats- 61 19 8 131.48 :thumbsdow

As for the Bama fan saying he is smarter with the ball, look at his ints. Also, anyone that watched the game last night knows he could easily have thrown about 2 more picks. Rain isn't an excuse for forcing the ball into coverage and jeopardizing your team's chances at winning the game. So, looking at these stats, I don't get how people conclude he is the better passer. Tebow is 1st in QB rating, and Ryan is 51st. It is like comparing night and day.

P.S. If you choose to debate these stats, that is fine just don't give me the better cast/more talent around him excuse.

[D^3]

Just curious...You don't think Tebow is a good passing QB? He seems fairly accurate to me. I won't say the most accurate out there but he is certainly amongst them IMO. I think that b/c UF runs the ball so much( wheather it be Tebow, Moore, Harvin, etc.) that takes away from the number of pass attempts that Tebow could throw if we ran a more traditional style offense. My point is that when Tebow does throw the ball, its usually right on. Ive seem him go deep a number of times this year with good success. Ive seen the ball bounce of WR's chest and hands a number of times. He rarley throws a bad ball.
He has 17 passing TD's compared to 10 on the ground.

Not trying to start anything negative with you, just curious of your opinion and the reasons why. You seem like a pretty cool guy. Together, you and I will be begging the red cross for bottles of water in the next 2 months.:laugh:

I'm certainly not saying Tebow can't throw the ball, he's proved that he can. But his strength is in his ability to run it, and that's also what's getting him Heisman attention. Ryan on the other hand is a more skilled passing QB. He throws it with finesse, and he can also throw a perfect ball under pressure. Tebow generally runs it himself under pressure. That's just the difference between them.

[Gator2753]

I'm certainly not saying Tebow can't throw the ball, he's proved that he can. But his strength is in his ability to run it, and that's also what's getting him Heisman attention. Ryan on the other hand is a more skilled passing QB. He throws it with finesse, and he can also throw a perfect ball under pressure. Tebow generally runs it himself under pressure. That's just the difference between them.

Gotcha! And I agree.

[D^3]

I don't get why just because Tebow can run, everyone assumes he isn't as good at passing the ball.

Comp % TDs Ints QB rating
Tebow's stats-66 17 3 177.48 :thumpsup:
Ryan's stats- 61 19 8 131.48 :thumbsdow


Yes but look at the attempts:

Ryan: 217 of 356, 2,433 yards.
Tebow: 115 of 174, 1,711 yards

Matt Ryan throws the ball almost twice as often as Tebow does. If Tebow doesn't have an almost sure completion in front of him he keeps it, so of course his completion % is better. But that's also why the Gators have lost 2 games, because he won't make that throw down field when the Gators don't have the time to keep it on the ground. The situation last night in the BC game where Matt Ryan threw a perfect TD pass to win the game, Tebow would have tried to run it and time would have run out.

[LSU PRIDE]

yea come on now flynn was great agaisnt VT

[LSU PRIDE]

well flynn wasnt actually that great he only had 217 yards passin and 1 rushin TD

[GatorNation]

Yes but look at the attempts:

Ryan: 217 of 356, 2,433 yards.
Tebow: 115 of 174, 1,711 yards

Matt Ryan throws the ball almost twice as often as Tebow does.


Yes, and Tebow has 71% of Ryan's passing yards on half the attempts.

[lacene]

Under the formula that's used for NCAA QB efficiency ratings, the # of pass attempts drastically affect the rating. The higher the attempts, the lower the rating, even if that QB also increases his yards and TD's....

[PuddingTime]

That said, the weather was pretty bad. I would think Ryan would have had a better game without the monsoon

When Heisman voters look at the numbers at the end of the year, they won't see rain in there.

Ryan played about 2 minutes of good football and BC was lucky to escape w/a win. I found myself saying Kentucky would've mopped the floor w/either of those teams. Neither was very impressive. Tech's defense did have some shining moments. Ryan did not impress me at all. After watching the likes of Woodson and Tebow all season, he's gotta do more than that to impress me. He hadn't even broken 100 yds passing by halftime. That's ridiculous you could even talk about him being in the Heisman race.

[gatoraus]

When Heisman voters look at the numbers at the end of the year, they won't see rain in there.

Ryan played about 2 minutes of good football and BC was lucky to escape w/a win. I found myself saying Kentucky would've mopped the floor w/either of those teams. Neither was very impressive. Tech's defense did have some shining moments. Ryan did not impress me at all. After watching the likes of Woodson and Tebow all season, he's gotta do more than that to impress me. He hadn't even broken 100 yds passing by halftime. That's ridiculous you could even talk about him being in the Heisman race.

Totally agree, Pudding. I think the Gators, Kentucky, LSU, Bama, Auburn, SC, Georgia and Tennessee could have beat both those teams last night.

[GatorBait15]

When Heisman voters look at the numbers at the end of the year, they won't see rain in there.

Ryan played about 2 minutes of good football and BC was lucky to escape w/a win. I found myself saying Kentucky would've mopped the floor w/either of those teams. Neither was very impressive. Tech's defense did have some shining moments. Ryan did not impress me at all. After watching the likes of Woodson and Tebow all season, he's gotta do more than that to impress me. He hadn't even broken 100 yds passing by halftime. That's ridiculous you could even talk about him being in the Heisman race.

thank you.. he was terrible! 2 minutes of good ball if vt had a offense they would have blew them out any sec team could beat b,c.... b,c only scored 20 vrs notre dame 4 god sake.... even a back up from usc put up 40 give me a break! good qb not a heisman winner sorry! OVERRATED

[GatorHunter]

Yes but look at the attempts:

Ryan: 217 of 356, 2,433 yards.
Tebow: 115 of 174, 1,711 yards

Matt Ryan throws the ball almost twice as often as Tebow does. If Tebow doesn't have an almost sure completion in front of him he keeps it, so of course his completion % is better. But that's also why the Gators have lost 2 games, because he won't make that throw down field when the Gators don't have the time to keep it on the ground. The situation last night in the BC game where Matt Ryan threw a perfect TD pass to win the game, Tebow would have tried to run it and time would have run out.

The Gators have lost 2 games because our defense is weak...had nothing to do with Tebow...he actually played very well in both games.