My theory on Sept. 11, 2001 [Archive]

Neo

12-29-2004, 10:05 PM

Well, there's no one person that you can blame really. Who's ultimately responsible? The Israelis, Palestinians, Saudis or Iraqis? Personally, given that this attack was on such a grand and tedious scale, it required more than just a few suicidal individuals with a cause. This attack required routes, times, positions and everything was timed perfectly. Me personally, I think it was a joint operation between the US and Israel.

After researching this for a full two (2) days, I have found a good bit of information that could possibly validate at least part of my assumptions. Below you will find my observations. Some are directly copied from other sites and some are my own typed up opinions. This is just a summation of my feelings and I will write a full blown report in the next few days.

USA:
The United States has been slowly trying to limit our liberties one day at a time and establish a "New World Order." This is turn would become no more than a dictatorship. See the "Patriot Act 1&2" and the "Intelligence Reform Act." Both of those proposed laws nullify many of our rights in the Constitution. What would the US gain by inflicting harm on itself? Well, there is only one way to put this. Fear is one of the most powerful tools available for manipulating a group of people to do your bidding. This has been proven throughout military history, used brilliantly by everyone from the leaders of ancient Persia to the political leaders of today. Whether there is an actual enemy or not, a fearful populace is a willing populace. Therefore, in the absence of a real enemy, one needs simply to create a convincing alternative. Keep the people in fear, and they will support your agenda - it's very simple, really, and it works. As of now, the Patriot Act has been singed into law and the US Government wants to extend it's powers with the Patriot Act 2 & the Intelligence Reform Act. Don't let the word reform fool you. There isn't a bit of reform in this act. Not to mention that President Bush does NOT think highly of Arabs. Could there be a religious twist to this story?

How do you scare someone? You scare them by creating panic and confusion. If you don't have relative enemies, create them. Case in mind, Osama Bin Laden, which by the way was a US ally in the 80's. The plan was very simple. Execute mass killing and scare the hell outta everyone so they can depend on big brother government to protect them. It's like what John Ashcroft said that is so touching.

"We must suspend certain freedoms to protect your freedoms and catch terrorists."

Patriot Act: http://www.ala.org/ala/oif/ifissues/usapatriotact.htm
http://www.fas.org/irp/crs/RS21203.pdf
http://www.aclu.org/SafeandFree/SafeandFree.cfm?ID=12263&c=206
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=107_cong_bills&docid=f:h3162enr.txt.pdf

Patriot Act 2: http://www.disinfopedia.org/wiki.phtml?title=Patriot_Act_II
http://www.lib.washington.edu/Suzref/patriot-act/

What kind of mentality is that? Do you think that Americans are really that ignorant? Obviously so, because all 131 pages of law were ratified and signed into law by President Bush less than 6 weeks after 9/11. The original draft of the USA Patriot Act was a whopping 2000 pages long. Due to time constraints and wanting to get it signed quickly, a lot of the petty stuff was trashed and it was passed shortly thereafter. What I find ironic is that the president proposed the so called USA Patriot Act eight (8) days after 9/11. Why so quickly? Unless they already had prior knowledge of 9/11 and was planning to use scare tactics to pass this bill. You don't write up 2000 pages and check the legalities in eight days time. I don't buy it.

Now we get to the nitty gritty. Who is capable of pulling this off. As I stated, the only other government that could entertain an operation of this scale and magnitude that's not an enemy is Israel. Israel has one of the world's best intelligence services and is tied into a lot of sensitive networks in the USA. Who would be better advisors or so called experts in dealing with terrorism? Israel deals with it everyday.

You have to be asking why would Israel help with something like this? Well, look at the picture one frame at a time. Who are Israel's enemies? There's Egypt, Iran, Pakistan, Lebanon, IRAQ and the rest of the muslim world. Remember the Iraqi's fired on Israel during Desert Storm.

Okay, so we have a possibilty of Israeli involvement. What would the Israeli's get in return? Well, how about the systematic removal of the very countries that threaten your existance? Hmmm, now we may be onto something. First Saddam Hussein of Iraq was removed from power and now we have our sights on the Ayatolla of Iran.

Continued on next post!!!!!

Neo

12-29-2004, 10:12 PM

Continued From First Post

Israel:

Did anyone know that 5 Israelis were arrested on 9/11 after eye witnesses claimed they saw them cheering and conducting surveillance on the WTC during the attacks. Shortly thereafter, they packed up their equipment and drove away in a white Chevrolet van. Below is a transcript of the 911 call.
One anonymous phone call to the authorities actually led them to close down all of New York's bridges and tunnels. The mystery caller told the 9-1-1 dispatcher that a group of Palestinians were mixing a bomb inside of a white van headed for the Holland Tunnel. Here’s the transcript from NBC News:
Dispatcher: Jersey City police.
Caller: Yes, we have a white van, 2 or 3 guys in there, they look like Palestinians and going around a building.
Caller: There's a minivan heading toward the Holland tunnel, I see the guy by Newark Airport mixing some junk and he has those sheikh uniform.
Dispatcher: He has what?
Caller: He's dressed like an Arab.

Why would this mystery caller specifically say that these “Arabs” were Palestinians? How would he know that? Palestinians usually dress in western style clothes, not “sheikh uniforms”. Based on that phone call, police then issued a “Be-on-the-Lookout” alert for a white mini-van heading for the city’s bridges and tunnels from New Jersey. When a van fitting that exact description was stopped just before crossing into New York, the suspicious “middle-easterners” were apprehended. Imagine the surprise of the police officers when these terror suspects turned out to be Israelis!
According to ABC’s 20/20, when the van belonging to the cheering Israelis was stopped by the police, the driver of the van, Sivan Kurzberg, told the officers:

"We are Israelis. We are not your problem. Your problems are our problems. The Palestinians are your problem."

The police and FBI field agents really became suspicious when they found maps of the city with certain places highlighted, box cutters (the same items that the hijackers supposedly used), $4700 cash stuffed in a sock, and foreign passports. Police also told the Bergen Record that bomb sniffing dogs were brought to the van and that they reacted as if they had smelled explosives.

http://www.fpp.co.uk/online/01/12/WTC_Mysteries3.html

The Jerusalem Post later reported that a white van with a bomb was stopped as it approached the George Washington Bridge. Of Course, the Post did not reveal the true ethnicity of the suspects. Here’s what the Jerusalem Post reported on September 12, 2001:

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/jpost.html

Is it pure coincidence that Al-Qaeda use huge truck bombs as a hallmark of their terror campaign?

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/forget.html

It appears as if there may actually have been two white vans involved, one stopped on each crossing. This would not only explain the conflicting reports as to the actual location of the arrests, but would also explain how so many credible eye-witnesses all saw celebrating "middle-easterners" in a white van in so many different locations. It also explains why the New York Post and Steve Gordon (lawyer for the 5 Israelis) originally described how three Israelis were arrested but later increased the total to five.
Perhaps one van was meant to drop off a bomb while the other was meant to pick up the first set of drivers while re-crossing back into New Jersey? If a van was to be used as a parked time-bomb on the GW Bridge, then certainly the drivers would need to have a "get-away van" to pick them up and escape. And notice how the van (or vans) stayed away from the third major crossing -the Holland Tunnel- which was where the police had originally been directed to by that anti-Palestinian 9-1-1 "mystery caller". A classic misdirection play.

From there, the story gets becomes even more suspicious. The Israelis worked for a Weehawken moving company known as Urban Moving Systems. An American employee of Urban Moving Systems told the The Record of New Jersey that a majority of his co-workers were Israelis and they were all joking about the attacks. 'I was in tears,' the man said. 'These guys were joking and that bothered me. These guys were like, "Now America knows what we go through."

The identities and nationalities of the employees were confirmed by the Jerusalem Post. What authorities have not elaborated on is the connection between the confiscated Sears Tower video that was found in Pennsylvania and the antics of Urban Moving System's employees. Additionally, the INS has recently signed papers that will allow the detained Israeli's to be deported without having to stand trial for possible involvement in the events of September 11th. Was the fourth plane headed toward the Sears Tower before it made an abrupt turn over Ohio?

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/sears2.html

A few days after the attacks, Urban Moving System's Israeli owner, Dominick Suter, dropped his business and fled the country for Israel. He was in such a hurry to flee America that some of Urban Moving System's customers were left with their furniture stranded in storage facilities.

http://www.state.nj.us/lps/ca/press/storage.htm

It was later confirmed that the five detained Israelis were in fact Israeli Mossad (Secret Service) agents. They were held in custody for 71 days before being quietly released. Some of the movers had been kept in solitary confinement for 40 days.

http://www.forward.com/issues/2002/02.03.15/news2.html

Several of the detainees discussed their experience in America on an Israeli talk show after their return home. One of the men, denying that they were laughing or happy on the morning of Sept. 11, "The fact of the matter is we are coming from a country that experiences terror daily. Our purpose was to document the event." How did they know there would be an event to document on 9/11?
It doesn’t take an IQ of 1000+ to connect the dots of the dancing Israeli Mossad agents - here's the most logical scenario:

1. The Israeli “movers” cheered the 9-11 attacks to celebrate the successful accomplishment of the greatest spy operation ever pulled off in history.

2. One of them, or an accomplice, then calls a 9-1-1 police dispatcher to report Palestinian bomb-makers in a white van headed for the Holland Tunnel.

3. Having thus pre-framed the Palestinians/Arabs with this phone call, the Israeli bombers then head for the George Washington Bridge instead, where they will drop off their time-bomb van and escape with Urban Moving accomplices.

4. But the police react very wisely and proactively by closing off ALL bridges and tunnels instead of just the Holland Tunnel. This move inadvertently foils the Israelis’ misdirection play and leads to their own capture and 40 day torture.

5. To cover up this story, the U.S. Justice Department rounds up over 1000 Arabs for minor immigration violations and places them in New York area jails. The Israelis therefore become less conspicuous as the government and media can now claim that the Israelis were just immigration violators caught in the same dragnet as many other Arabs.

6. After several months, FBI and Justice Department “higher-ups” are able to gradually push aside the local FBI agents and free the Israelis quietly.

Continued on next post...

Neo

12-29-2004, 10:13 PM

Continued from Part 2...

The compliant mainstream media completely ignored the Israeli connection. Immediately following the 9-11 attacks, the media was filled with stories linking the attacks to bin Laden. TV talking-heads, “experts”, and scribblers of every stripe spoon-fed a gullible American public a steady diet of the most outrageous propaganda imaginable. We were told the reason bin Laden attacked the USA was because he hates our “freedom” and “democracy”. We were told Muslims were “medieval” and wanted to destroy us because they envied our wealth, were still bitter about the Crusades, and they were offended by Britney Spears shaking her boobs and azz all over the place!

Bin Laden strongly denied any role in the attacks and he suggested they were orchestrated by Zionists. The BBC published his statement of denial, in it he said:

"I was not involved in the September 11 attacks in the United States nor did I have knowledge of the attacks. There exists a government within a government within the United States. The United States should try to trace the perpetrators of these attacks within itself; to the people who want to make the present century a century of conflict between Islam and Christianity. That secret government must be asked as to who carried out the attacks."

You never heard that quote on your nightly newscast did you? To date, the only shred of evidence to be uncovered against Bin Laden was a barely audible fuzzy amateur video that the Pentagon just happened to find "lying around" in Afghanistan. How very convenient.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/osamatape.html

There is no evidence, be it hard or circumstantial, to link the Al-Qaeda "terrorist network" to these acts of terror, but there is a mountain of evidence, both hard and circumstantial, which suggests that the Zionist Mafia has been very busy framing Arabs for terror plots against America.

One last thing. At 0940 on 9/11 Abu Dhabi television reported that the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine claimed responsiblity for the attacks. This claim was immediately denied by the DFLP leader Qais abu Leila who said it had always opposed "terror attacks on civilian targets, especially outside the occupied territories."

http://edition.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/europe/09/11/trade.centre.reaction/

Why would a Palestinian organisation comprising of less than 500 people make the suicidal move of immediately claiming responsibility for the attacks?

One thing is for sure, if the the Israelis had successfully framed the Palestinians/Arabs for the 9/11 attacks then Ariel Sharon and his government would have had the perfect excuse to expel the Palestinian population from the West Bank and Gaza Strip because the citizens there would have been labelled as terrorists.

So ask yourself. Are you sure that Osama Bin Laden without a doubt is responsibile for 9/11?

Neo

12-29-2004, 10:17 PM

Just read each one in order. There is a character limit so I had to break it up into multiple parts.

got2skigrl

12-29-2004, 11:09 PM

RW13

12-29-2004, 11:26 PM

Great work, greatly appreciate the effort. I don't know where to start, you gave so much info, so I'll try to cover everything. 1st of all I can see Israel having alot to gain by this. In Sept. 2000, 1 year prior to the attacks, the Palestinians resumed attacks on Israel after a negotiated seize-fire negotiated by the U.S. (1998 Wye river accords maybe?). 2nd, I remember reading in some online media that Osama initially denied the attacks. Maybe our gov't found him soon after the attacks and paid him to hide out and make tapes every so often, it's not out of the realm of possibility, considering we paid him in the 80's to fight the U.S.S.R., he wasn't a stranger to our payroll. I don't know what to think of the Israeli agents though. Hell I just found out yesterday that 1 of the flights didn't even happen, the pentagon was not hit by flight AA 77, I saw that with my own eyes for god's sake, and am still dumbfounded. The problem I have is where did that plane and it's crew go? B/c if it crashed on land anywhere and I mean anywhere, someone, somewhere would have reported it. End of Part 1.....

Neo

12-29-2004, 11:27 PM

yes, he was the finances atleast. he has said many times- i know the media can edit things for their own personal use but besides that fact- he knew about the attacks, was happy that it happened, and it was a victory for muslems and their jihad against america. if he was not atleast partof- which i am certian he played a role in- the 9-11 attacks, we are in a war on terrorsts, of wich he is one. we should not let a man of his power get a second chance- 1st if you dont believe he was part of the attacks of 9-11- he has threatened us and should not be allowed to harm any more unexpecting and innocent americans. as bush has said we are at war with terrorists. we will not rest until we are safe. we are not safe with a man like ben laden in power and i dont want more people to die because of letting a man like ben laden go free -ahem bill clinton-ahem-- atleast thats my $.02

The only thing about that is we do not have real evidence to prove that Osama had something to do with this. Just the US Government's word that he did, but we have MOUNTAINS of evidence against the Israelis. Don't get me wrong, this guy is sick and he needs to be thrown in a cell and throw away the cell, but we need to do that for a crime he committed and not for a crime he didn't commit.

I honestly do not think that Osama Bin Laden had anything to do with what happened on Sept. 11th. This operation was so concise, technical and everything depended on timing. This incident is bigger than Osama and Al-Qaida. Only a high powered government with an endless payroll could be so precise. Have you ever noticed the endless support the US shows for Israel no matter what the circumstances are?

RW13

12-29-2004, 11:34 PM

There are very good motives for the Israelis obviously, hell Arafat is suspected of being poisened, the most important figure of the Arab/muslim movement of the 20th century. The Israelis love that we took over two countries and maybe more to come, plus they are able to keep an inept right wing leader like Sharon in b/c the country would favor a right wing gov't in time of fear, much like the U.S. reelecting Bush. BTW Benjamin Nentanyahu and Bill Clinton brokered the most peace between Israel and PLO ever, left-wingers! Anyways, is oil a part of this? Of course, it could be, the Bush family(and I'm not being biased here, or trying to be anti-bush, b/c I'm really not like that) has documented ties to Saudis and Saudi oil. 16 of the 19 hi-jackers were Saudi. Bottom Line for me:....... Real People were murdered, real people, innocent ppl lost their lives on Sept. 11th. Somebody needs to be held accountable and responsible. The truth needs to surface, no matter how ugly that truth is, no matter who is ultimately responsible, that person needs to be punished, whether it be our gov't, the israelis, or terrorists. Somehow, someway, american citizens like ourselves need to know the truth, we are owed that much, our family died on Sept. 11th, and continues to die in Iraq and Afghanistan (my best friend for 16 years is in Iraq right now BTW), if he and ppl like him are going to continue to risk their lives, we need to know what the hell really happened and what the hell is really going on.....

RW13

12-29-2004, 11:37 PM

Osama is guilty of other crimes at least, he was on the FBI's most wanted prior to 2001, at least dating back to 1998. He was behind the africa embassy bombings which recieved no press btw, I wonder why, it was a story for like 2 hrs, that's it, and it was a timed and coordinated attack. He is also responsible for the 1996 attacks on U.S. bunkers in Saudi Arabia, 1993 Somalia (trace amounts), and some attack in 1989, not sure what that was....

Neo

12-29-2004, 11:38 PM

RW13

12-29-2004, 11:42 PM

Neo

12-29-2004, 11:48 PM

At least the Supreme court is fighting this to some extent and some communities across america. The supreme court has already struck down 2 parts to the patriot act claiming it is unconstitutional, obviously. Also, I'm not sure if you're aware but cities and counties across america are voting and refusing to accept the patriot act, esp. a bunch in california and oregon, I believe San Francisco is one of the biggest cities not to recognize the act. City/County Councils voted, and in some cases referendums passed, which makes me optimistic, there is hope for this country, as long as freedom loving ppl are willing to fight tyranny....

Yes they are fighting it, but it's rather scary that the US Government may be doing it anyways.

Under the USA Patriot Act 1 & 2 the USG can....

1. Arrest you and deny you an attorney regardless of your citizenship.
2. Search you or your property without a Federal warrant and without your knowledge.
3. Hold you indefinitely without due process. (See USA born citizen: Jose Padillia)
4. Conduct electronic/human surveillance with/without a warrant or probable cause.
5. Deport you even if you are a US citizen without due process of law.

This is a crash-course short list of things that the USA Patriot Act allows the DOJ (Dept. of Justice) to do. Scary isn't it?

BTW: The US Government was ordered by the US Supreme Court last year to charge American born Jose Padillia or release him immediately. He is still sitting in a military brig in Charleston, SC. He has been in that brig since 01 without an attorney, family visits and due process of law. The funny thing is that he's not even Islamic. He's hispanic of Cuban decent.

Neo

12-29-2004, 11:55 PM

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."

"The government is best that governs least."

"A bill of rights is what the people are entitled to against every government on earth, general or particular; and what no just government should refuse, or rest on inference."

Thomas Jefferson

RW13

12-30-2004, 12:57 AM

Like I said, I have hope b/c of freedom loving ppl like us, I know I'm willing and I know alot of other ppl willing to spill blood just like my entire family has done before me, I've had members of my family fight in every major U.S. conflict, and had 3 that died in the line of duty as police officers, and their are many ppl/families like mine who are willing to sacrifice their lives to ensure freedom....

Neo

12-30-2004, 02:32 AM

cocky4ever

12-30-2004, 07:57 AM

Like the saying in New Hampshire......

"Live free or die!" :)
Great research. We will only begin to get an idea of what really happened on 9/11 if we keep asking questions. I think it involved many countries and organizations for many different reasons.It was such a detailed plan that we will probably never know the whole truth of the matter. I've always said that you get the best idea of a govts. intention by watching how they react to situations and not how they act on their own. Look at the amount of time it took to try to install the patriot act. It's like they already had it written up. Now consider how long it took to pass the intelligence reform bill which is supposed to protect us while leaving out the 2 most important safety measures it could include. I watched family members of 9/11 victims on C-SPAN begging anyone in congress who would listen to not support the intelligence reform until it addressed key areas of concern. Of course it passed within a week of that. The administration will not do anything to close borders because of the money that big companies can get by hiring illegal aliens. Thats why they want to give them drivers licenses. Terrorists are pouring into our country across the borders we want to give them drivers licenses. Sure the terrorists may kill some people but look at the money made by the companies, a lot of which donated to the campaign of Bush. No offense to Got2skigrl but if you think the current administration is making this country safer you are sadly mistaken.
Also since you brought up Bill Clinton I have to say something. When will things stop being his fault? What did he do? Let's see, well, he greatly improved our economy. He even helped strengthen trade with many, many countries which helped their economies and eventually helped ours. He built up the first ever, and might I add a rather nice, surplus in this country. That alone would have paid for social security for decades to come. Now we must find another 2 TRILLION dollars for that. He kept the world as a whole pretty much peaceful with very little force. Sure he dropped some bombs on Iraq, but that was just to let Hussein know that we were keeping him in check and it's not like we took over the country. Plus his plan worked because after we got to Iraq to look for these "weapons" it was discoverd that not only did he not have any but that his weapons program had been getting weaker ever since the first Iraq war. Do you remember what started WWI? A state sponsored assasination. That is exactly what us killing Bin Laden would have been back then. The Bush administration had knowledge of the 9/11 attacks so maybe he was the one who didnt keep us safe. Again I say you must look at his actions to find his intentions. What bills has he passed to take away rights? What bills has he passed to make us safer? From what I see the Bush administration doesnt have my safety as a top priority, only more money for the big corporations.

Neo

12-30-2004, 01:09 PM

Also since you brought up Bill Clinton I have to say something. When will things stop being his fault? What did he do? Let's see, well, he greatly improved our economy. He even helped strengthen trade with many, many countries which helped their economies and eventually helped ours. He built up the first ever, and might I add a rather nice, surplus in this country. That alone would have paid for social security for decades to come. Now we must find another 2 TRILLION dollars for that.

Thanks Cocky. I researched my theory for 2 whole days and that's what I found.

As for Bill Clinton, I have to agree with got2skigrl and I'll tell you why.

Terrorists are like children. They will try to push you to your breaking point to see how far they can go. Well they kept pushing Clinton more and more. For example;

Oklahoma City (I don't think Tim McVeigh did it. Ask me why)
USS Cole
Embassies in Africa
1st WTC bombing
Marine Barracks in Saudi Arabia
TWA Flight 800

That's six (6) different terrorist attacks during Mr. Clinton's presidency and the bad thing is, we have one (1) during Bush's term and now we want to crucify him.

As for the budget surplus, you are correct. He did have a surplus. Where did the surplus come from though is what you should be asking. Well, it came from the numerous cuts to the military and intelligence services.

Now I know this doesn't apply to Clinton, but it does apply to his wife. She is proposing a bill that would limit gun ownership by private law abiding citizens. That my friend, is very dangerous. An armed populace is the only thing that keeps our government in check.

Just so you know I'm not a Republician. I am a registered Libertarian here in NC.

To sum it up, I think 9/11 was a joint operation between the US and Israel.

Neo

12-30-2004, 01:29 PM

I'll keep digging for more info on this topic.

Neo

12-30-2004, 02:07 PM

The suggestion of an Israeli connection to the events surrounding 9/11 did not spring, full blown, like Athena from the head of Zeus. It had been hovering in the background, implied in odd accounts such as the one about the group of Israelis picked by the FBI after they were spotted in Liberty State Park, Jersey City, NJ, laughing and giving each other high-fives as the World Trade Center burned on the other side of the river. In an astonishing story in the Bergen Record, we learn that 5 men described as "Israeli tourists," were picked up 8 hours after the WTC attack, "carrying maps linking them to the blasts." Sources close to the investigation said they found other evidence linking the men to the bombing plot. 'There are maps of the city in the car with certain places highlighted,' the source said. 'It looked like they're hooked in with this. It looked like they knew what was going to happen when they were at Liberty State Park. According to this account, the 5 "tourists" had been picked up by local police after receiving the following alert from the FBI:

"Vehicle possibly related to New York terrorist attack. White, 2000 Chevrolet van with New Jersey registration with 'Urban Moving Systems' sign on back seen at Liberty State Park, Jersey City, NJ, at the time of first impact of jetliner into World Trade Center. Three individuals with van were seen celebrating after initial impact and subsequent explosion. FBI Newark Field Office requests that, if the van is located, hold for prints and detain individuals."

Then there was the story about the two employees of the Odigo Company, an Israeli-based "instant-messaging" software company, with New York offices in the vicinity of the WTC, who received messages in the hours before disaster struck that the World Trade Center would be hit. I was so skeptical of this report, published in Ha'aretz, an Israeli daily newspaper, that I wrote the author: he confirmed the contents of these mysterious missives and cited his sources. In this context, the Washington Post story fit into an eerie pattern: it was not the final but the definitive piece of the puzzle: the piece that, once found and put in place, evokes an exclamation of "so that's what it is!" I was alone, at the time, in raising the possibility of an Israeli angle to the story of 9/11 – but not for long.

http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=77744&contrassID=/has%5C

On December 11, Fox News ran the first of a four-part series by Carl Cameron that offered yet more evidence to support my contention that the Israelis had some rather specific foreknowledge of the 9/11 atrocity. Citing sources in law enforcement, Cameron dropped a bombshell:

"A handful of active Israeli military were among those detained, according to investigators, who say some of the detainees also failed polygraph questions when asked about alleged surveillance activities against and in the United States. There is no indication that the Israelis were involved in the 9-11 attacks, but investigators suspect that they may have gathered intelligence about the attacks in advance, and not shared it. A highly placed investigator said there are – quote – 'tie-ins.' But when asked for details, he flatly refused to describe them, saying, – quote – 'evidence linking these Israelis to 9-11 is classified. I cannot tell you about evidence that has been gathered. It's classified information.' Fox News has learned that one group of Israelis, spotted in North Carolina recently, is suspected of keeping an apartment in California to spy on a group of Arabs who the United States is also investigating for links to terrorism."

Could it be that the Israeli's were a part of 9/11 or were they just spectators?

got2skigrl

12-30-2004, 02:15 PM

Neo

12-30-2004, 02:30 PM

well actually licoln did almost the same thing during the war between the states/civil war- he passed a law where one could be arrested and held in jail for "suspicion" of being a spy and the government-aka army- could use anything of citizens they needed with out permission. this is not a new thing to happen in time of war. and not just the president passed this. 2/3 of the senators elected by the people had to approve it. and it is only good while we are at war. its not like the government is going to go to your house and just arrest you for no reason, they are just trying to speed up the process of capturing terrorist by not needing such things as search warrents.

That statement alone goes against what our forefathers died for. The 4th Amendment protects us against searches and seizures without a court issued warrant and due process of law. The USA Patriot Act nullifies the following amendments;

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation

Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.

One thing that people don't realize is that the Bill of Rights does NOT say what we can or cannot do. It limits what the GOVERNMENT can or cannot do. If you allow walls to be put up concerning certain God given freedoms, then we may wake up and find out that walls have been built up around ALL of our freedoms.

So based on your assumptions on arrest and search powers, we are going to trust the government (A government that has lied to it's people consistantly) to not abuse their powers? HA! I'll believe that when I win the lottery, have a car accident, open heart surgery and get struck by lightning in the same day.

If you don't think they arrest US CITIZENS without probable cause, do a Google.com search on US born citizen Jose Padillia.

I love this country with all of my heart. I'm a registered Libertarian here in NC and I DO NOT believe in trading my freedoms to make peoples lives easier. Our freedom is exactly what makes this country the best in the world.

got2skigrl

12-30-2004, 02:51 PM

look in a history book dude it happened it will ahppen again and america is no worse for it

got2skigrl

12-30-2004, 02:53 PM

i knnow what the constitution says but it also has provisions for times of war

Neo

12-30-2004, 02:54 PM

Posing as "art students" selling cheap handicrafts and paintings, as many as 120 young Israelis – the majority of whom "stated they served in military intelligence, electronic surveillance intercept and or explosive ordinance units" in the Israeli army – made contact with US government officials and personnel in "hundreds of incidents and towns across the country." Indeed, there had been so many news reports in local media, concentrated especially in Texas and Florida, detailing this activity that the National Counterintellligence Center issued the following alert:

"In the past six weeks, employees in federal office buildings located throughout the United States have reported suspicious activities connected with individuals representing themselves as foreign students selling or delivering artwork. Employees have observed both males and females attempting to bypass facility security and enter federal buildings."

These "students," the NCC observed, who "have been described as aggressive," didn't seem too interested in selling anybody anything, and instead seemed intent on simply gaining access. Two were arrested (in Texas) and, lo and behold, it was discovered that their work visas and green cards were counterfeit. One particularly eerie aspect of all this is these "students" turning up at "the private residences of senior federal officials under the guise of selling art." On October 2, KHOU-TV of Houston, Texas, reported that, earlier in the year, these guys were caught sneaking into "federal buildings and defense sites," and, in Dallas,

"The so-called students hit early this year at the city's FBI building, the Drug Enforcement Administration and at the Earle Cabell Federal building, where guards found one student wandering the halls with a floor plan of the building."

"A few of the operatives are well known in the Israeli intelligence community. The report cited the names of Peer Segalovitz (military registration number 5087989) and Aran Ofek, son of a renowned two-star general in the Israeli army. The network targeted some of the most sensitive sites in the U.S., such as Tanker Air Force Base near Oklahoma City. Indeed, the U.S. Air Force's Office of Special Investigation sent a letter to the Justice Department on May 16 of last year to ask for assistance in a case against four Israelis suspected of spying: Yaron Ohana, Ronen Kalfon, Zeev Cohen and Naor Topaz."

A reporter goes on a limb here and states

Neo

12-30-2004, 02:59 PM

9/11 - WHAT DID THE GOVERNMENT KNOW AND WHEN DID IT KNOW IT?

The task was simple, deny the evidence, cover-up the embarrassing arrest of two Israelis with an explosives-tainted truck, and give the media a reason to return to the mantra of "all terror is caused by Muslims". But what started as a simply attempt to spin the news away from the Israelis arrested in Washington State has backfired on the Bush administration in a big way. In conducting the classic "limited hangout" of admitting to foreknowledge of the attacks of 9-11 in order to reassert the link to Osama bin Laden, Bush has handed opponents of his administration and opponents of World War the most damning proof yet that the reality of 9-11 is not what the US Government and media have been telling the American people it is.
The arrested Israelis posed a problem. History records in the Lavon Affair that Israelis willingly use bombs and lay false trails to Arabs for political gain. And it wasn't too long ago that JDL Chairman Irv Rubin was arrested for plotting to blow up a US Congressman who refused to toe the Israel party line. Then there were the two Mossad agents arrested inside the Mexican Congress with guns and explosives shortly after 9-11. As the battered World Trade Towers collapsed, the very first suspects arrested, caught cheering as the towers fell, were Israelis, later identified as Mossad agents. The arrested spies worked for Urban Moving Systems, whose Israeli owner promptly fled the nation.

http://www.rense.com/general17/mossadagentsarrested.htm

In the end, three Israeli companies with deep penetration of the American communications infrastructure were implicated in the phone and internet tapping scandal. One of these companies, Odigo, had an office near the World Trade Towers, and received a two hour advance warning of the impending attack. Two hours means the warning was sent before the planes that eventually crashed into the World Trade Towers had even left the ground on their final flights! Someone knew of the plan, someone who decided they needed to warn Israelis working for a company linked to Israel's spying operation.

Taken together, there is probable cause to investigate just what connection the Israeli spying operation had with 9-11. Such an investigation should have happened, but instead, something very odd took place in the investigation! According to a government official quoted in Carl Cameron's story on the spy ring, the US Government classified the evidence that links the arrested Israeli spies to 9-11. Rather than treat the arrested spies as Jonathan Pollard had been treated, the US Government hurried to get the arrested Israelis out of the country as quickly as possible, in one case releasing and deporting one Israeli even though he failed his polygraph examination! Pollard had been just one spy. Here was the largest spy ring ever uncovered in the United States and the United States itself was trying to cover it all up! The media went along by downplaying the Rubin story, ignoring the Mexican incident and actually spiking Carl Cameron's four part story on the spy ring.

http://www.americanfreepress.net/Mideast/Israelis_Arrested_and_Detained/israelis_arrested_and_detained.html

As quiet as the media was about the evidence pointing towards Israeli involvement in 9-11, the media was quite the opposite when it came to claims of proof linking ex CIA agent Osama bin Laden with the crimes. The reason was obvious. Long before the attacks on the World Trade Towers the United States had been planning for a war in Afghanistan to create a climate more favorable for American oil companies. John Marcesca, as part of a UNOCAL working group on the Afghanistan pipeline project, had gone before Congress and stressed the necessity of replacing the Afghanistan government before a pipeline from the Caspian sea to the gulf of India could be built. The Bush White House admits that a plan to attack Afghanistan existed BEFORE 9-11. Following 9-11, the US did replace the government of Afghanistan, and the pipeline is under construction. One member of the UNOCAL working group, Hamid Karzai, is the President of the new government in Afghanistan. Another UNOCAL group member, Zalmay Khalilzad, is the US special envoy to Afghanistan. A cozy relationship to be sure!

http://www.janes.com/security/international_security/news/jir/jir010315_1_n.shtml
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/1550366.stm

Neo

12-30-2004, 03:02 PM

look in a history book dude it happened it will ahppen again and america is no worse for it

That doesn't make it right. It will continue as long as we have people that will accept it and not stand up against it.

got2skigrl

12-30-2004, 03:03 PM

dude youu mean to tell me that because of 1 guy we should just ignore the all of the true terrorist this thing has helped catch, right or wrong you elected the people to pass it. 2/3 of the senate think this is whats best for our country. and yes im sorry if i believe in what has been so great for over so long- this happens in times of war to protect people, im sure you would be complainin just the same if we didnt do anthing to stop the terrorist and they kept killin, well this is the government workin for you not against you.... has this passing of the law affected you in one way? have you been arrested or your privacy invaded? or are you complainin about something that has happened to 1 out of 250 million people

Neo

12-30-2004, 03:04 PM

i knnow what the constitution says but it also has provisions for times of war

No it does not!

Here is the Bill of Rights:

http://www.archives.gov/national_archives_experience/charters/bill_of_rights_transcript.html

Neo

12-30-2004, 03:17 PM

dude oyu mean to tell me that because of 1 guy we should just ignore the all of the true terrorist this thing has helped catch, right or wrong you elected the people to pass it because 2/3 of the senate think this is whats best for our country and yes im sorry if i believe in what has been so great for over so long- this happens in times of war to protect people, im sure you would be complainin just the same if we didnt do anthing to stop the terrorist and they kept killin, well this is the government workin for you not against you.... has this passing of the law affected you in one way? have you been arrested or your privacy invaded? or are you complainin about something that has happened to 1 out of 250 million people

When that guy is a US citizen and his rights are being trampled on, you bet!

You know who can protect you the best? YOU! You are the first line of defense. You are the one on the streets, driving to work, noticing things. We do not need "Big Brother" watching out every move. Nowadays, everyone wants big brother in their lives. That is opening up a can of worms that you will not be able to shut.

BTW: If you read the USA Patriot Act, there is NO provision that says it may be used only in a time of war.

When has the government ever actually done something for the citizens when it wasn't in their own best interests or have something to gain?

You will have to excuse my strong feelings on the matter. Us Libertarians have very strong views on the Constitution. We support it and believe in what it stands for.

If you really wanna fight terrorism, instead of these "bogus" search and arrest powers, how about closing our "Swiss Cheese" border with Mexico. That would do more for the war on terrorism than anything else.

Yes it has affected me. Now because of the USAPA, the US Government can at will, confiscate my financial records from my bank without a warrant. Whenever you open a new bank account, if you read the fine print you will see the USAPA clause. For starters, it's no one's business how much money I have. That's my private affairs. What about the US Transportation Security Administration running a criminal/credit check everytime I board an airline? The criminal/INTERPOL check I can handle, but a credit check?

People that sit back on this and accept it as a price to pay for the war on terrorism is making a big mistake. With all of this going on, have you noticed now all of the cameras everywhere?

got2skigrl

12-30-2004, 03:25 PM

i know the constitution/bill of rights does not specifically say we can pass this act.... but what you are forgetting is that law is ever changing. once lincoln passed a n act sayin we can invade private property ect. then it becomes possible for any president and the congress and senate of his time to pass a similar law until a new act or law is set stating that this is infact unlawful.

so yes you are right the government does not state in the constitution that this law is passes, but laws and judgements are based on past laws and judgements, and according to american law, this act is allowed to be passed by government

got2skigrl

12-30-2004, 03:28 PM

if you dont like it there are many things you can do besides complain.... write a letter to congress man/ senator, start a petition to end this law ect. i am not saying if this law is right or wrong im just giving the other sides arguments and saying this act is provided for because of previous similar acts, wich is how our government works

got2skigrl

12-30-2004, 03:30 PM

you know whats funny? im a libertarian too

Neo

12-30-2004, 03:49 PM

More twists to the 9/11 story?

The possibility that 19 Muslim men accused of being the Sept. 11 hijackers were not, in fact, the hijackers, is not so extraordinary an idea as it might seem.

http://www.americanfreepress.net/051302/FBI_Admits__No_Evidence_/fbi_admits__no_evidence_.html

Some of the suspects apparently used the stolen identities of at least five Saudis who worked in the airline industry as pilots, mechanics and flight attendants — people who would have had increased access in airports, a Saudi government official told the Sun-Sentinel.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/sfl-worldtrade-suspectprofiles.story

At least 7 of the 9/11 hijackers are still alive and are protesting their innocence.

Alleged hijackers:

American Airlines Flight 11
Boeing 767-223ER. Fuel capacity 24,000 gallons
Scheduled flight: Boston - Los Angeles
Flight departed 07:59 a.m.
Crashed into WTC 1 08:46 a.m.

Satam M.A. Al Suqami: Investigators discovered the passport of Satam al Suqami, one of the terrorists aboard American Airlines Flight 11, the first plane to hit the World Trade Center.

Waleed M. Alshehri - (Alive) Saudi Arabian pilot Waleed Al Shehri was one of five men that the FBI said had deliberately crashed American Airlines flight 11 into the World Trade Centre on 11 September. Now he is protesting his innocence from Casablanca, Morocco.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/1559151.stm

Wail M. Alshehri - (Alive) A man by the same name is a pilot whose father is a Saudi diplomat in Bombay. "I personally talked to both father and son today," [said Gaafar Allagany, head of the Saudi Embassy's information center.]

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-092101probe.story

Mohamed Atta - (Alive?) (Mohamed) Atta and (Abdulaziz) Alomari boarded a 6:00 a.m. flight from Portland to Boston's Logan International Airport.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2004/07/23/MNGEO7S1221.DTL

Atta's car was found abandoned at Boston's Logan Airport. [ABC News] How did Atta's car end up at Logan Airport?

http://edition.cnn.com/2001/US/09/12/investigation.terrorism/

A trail of evidence led investigators into Tuesday's terrorist attacks from one abandoned rental car in Portland, Maine, to two houses in Vero Beach, Florida. One of the Vero Beach houses had been rented by two brothers from Saudi Arabia. Inside it were two pilot's certificates in the names of Adnan Bukhari and his brother, Ameer Abbas Bukhari.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/1542153.stm

The two rented a car, a silver-blue Nissan Altima, from an Alamo car rental at Boston's Logan Airport and drove to an airport in Portland, Maine, where they got on US Airways Flight 5930 at 6 a.m. Tuesday headed back to Boston, the sources said.

Before CNN learned the identities of the two brothers, Portland Police Chief Mike Chitwood said, "I can tell you those two individuals did get on a plane and fly to Boston early yesterday morning ... I can tell you that they are the focus of a federal investigation." Adnan Bukhari's name reportedly appears on the American Airlines Flight Eleven manifest.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/2001-09-14/usw_nosuspect.asp

The second abandoned rental car was discovered in Boston's Logan Airport, where two of the hijacked flights originated. It too led investigators to the Florida homes of two pilots: Mohammed Atta and Marwan Yousef Al-Shehhi.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/1542153.stm

It would appear that the Bukharis' were the intended Portland patsies, but there were a couple of problems with this scenario. These unforeseen problems ultimately resulted in Atta 'inexplicably' abandoning two cars in two airports on 9/11.

got2skigrl

12-30-2004, 03:51 PM

The Patriot Act, passed shortly after the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks, has earned a critical eye over its provision that allows investigators to conduct searches and delay notification to*suspects if officials believe it would jeopardize the investigation. The law also authorizes nationwide search warrants for terrorism investigations, including for e-mail records, computer billing records and Internet use.

Quoting such figures as former Presidents Thomas Jefferson and Abraham Lincoln, Ashcroft says the new tools provided by the act are well grounded in the Constitution and have been vital to preventing terrorist attacks.

"We have used the tools provided in the Patriot Act to fulfill our first responsibility to protect the American people. We have used these tools to prevent terrorists from unleashing more death and destruction on our soil," Ashcroft said in a speech in Boise, Idaho, last month.

"We have used these tools to save innocent American lives. We have used these tools to provide the security that ensures liberty," he said.

Out of 535 members of Congress, 455 voted in favor of the Patriot Act following the terrorist attacks of September 11.

Part of the Patriot Act included a law enforcement tool called “sneak and peek,” which allows officials to execute a search warrant without the prior knowledge of the individual to be searched. It was okay in the fervor after September 11, but it’s not okay now.

Apparently Congress did not realize that AG Ashcroft did not discover or invent something new, but that “sneak and peek” had been around legally since the Supreme Court upheld the practice in 1979. But now it’s John Ashcroft’s fault.

The purpose of “sneak and peek” being in the Patriot Act is to catch terrorists before they terrorize. In fact, the Patriot Act narrows the use of “sneak and peek” by putting into law when such an action is permissible.

They now claim that “sneak and peek” violates our rights. Forget about the rights of people who fly in airliners or are otherwise caught in the wrong place at the wrong time when terrorists decide to carry out their heinous plans.

During all of the hand wringing over the Patriot Act, much of the wailing has been about proposals that never made it into the law. I don’t even care if John Ashcroft himself is hiding in the bushes in my front yard so long as he doesn’t trample my plants. But the point is, he is not in the bushes (the Democrats love those Bush puns) and he will not be hiding in the bushes because I don’t behave as described in the law.

I’m a “slippery slope” kind of guy, and I worry about abuse of power by the government. So long as law enforcement discerns those who break the law from those who do not, then we law-abiding folks have nothing to worry about. Have we not considered that every single day, long before the Patriot Act, law enforcement has made such distinctions? Bad guys and those suspected of being bad guys get treated one way, good guys get treated another.

By Brian W. Peterson

RW13

12-30-2004, 03:58 PM

are you a woman? Just curious b/c that would definately make sense, women hardly ever question more laws and less freedom as long as it makes them feel "safer." I know that's a broad statement and generalization but that's usually how it is. If you are a man, grow a pair and start defending the freedom that our forefathers gave us. We need more ppl like Del to keep the gov't in check. The gov't was not even close to the size/scope that it is today than when it was in 1789. It's time to draw a line in the sand....

Neo

12-30-2004, 04:05 PM

9/11 Story Continued:

It would appear that the Bukharis' were the intended Portland patsies, but there were a couple of problems with this scenario. These unforeseen problems ultimately resulted in Atta 'inexplicably' abandoning two cars in two airports on 9/11.

Mohamed Atta spoke excellent German - good enough to correct other students' texts - as well as fluent English and Arabic.

http://specials.ft.com/attackonterrorism/FT3LAJ6UMUC.html

Atta and two other suspected hijackers reported their passports stolen in late 1999.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/static/in_depth/world/2001/war_on_terror/investigation_on_terror/people_2.stm

Dekkers knew that Atta had lived in Hamburg, Germany and one day [in 2000] spoke to him in German as a way of friendly communication. Atta was stunned and quickly walked away. An imposter could pretend to be Atta, but he couldn't pretend to speak German.

Abdulaziz Alomari - (Alive) He is an example of FBI improvisation. The original pilot for Flight 11 was named as Abdul Rahman Al-Omari, the problem is he turned out to be alive. Undeterred, the FBI found a new Al-Omari to replace the alive 'hijacker'. There's just one problem with his replacement - he too is alive. Abdul Rahman Al-Omari, a pilot for Saudi Arabian Airlines:

U.S. officials in Riyadh offered Abdul Rahman Said al-Omari an official apology in the presence of Saudi interior ministry officials for including his name among the list of suspects in the U.S. terrorist attacks, news agencies reported Monday.

Omari, a pilot with Saudi Airlines, told the Saudi daily Al-Watan that he was amazed to see his name on the FBI's list of suspects allegedly involved in the attacks on the Pentagon and World Trade Center Tuesday, Agence France-Presse (AFP) reported. Omari said he returned to Saudi Arabia in early September after undergoing training for one year in the United States, AFP added.

Abdulaziz Al-Omari has the same name and birth date as the named FBI "terrorist", but he has no idea how to fly:
"I couldn't believe it when the FBI put me on their list. They gave my name and my date of birth, but I am not a suicide bomber. I am here. I am alive. I have no idea how to fly a plane. I had nothing to do with this." Mr Al-Omari said his passport was stolen when his apartment in Denver, Colorado, was burgled in 1995. He had been studying engineering at Denver University since 1993. He was given a new passport in Riyadh on December 31, 1995 and returned to America to resume his studies in January 1996.

On September 10, 2001 Atta and Al-Omari were photographed by a Fast Green ATM located in the parking lot of UNO's restaurant, 280 Maine Mall Road, South Portland, Maine.

http://www.fbi.gov/pressrel/pressrel01/100401.htm

Why is the FBI being allowed to openly lie about the identity of the person in the above photograph?

Check out the maifest for AA Flight 11.
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/AA11.victims.html

The Strange Case Of The Destroyed Black Box And The Indestructible Passport?
All four Black Boxes were supposedly destroyed and rendered unusable in spite of the fact that they are designed specifically for plane crashes which result in insurmountable conditions...yet one of the hijackers passports supposedly survives fire and heat of over 1,000 degrees fahrenheit and is found in perfect shape in the rubble around the WTC towers? What kind of idiots does the FBI take us for?

http://www.rense.com/general13/strangecase.htm

RW13

12-30-2004, 04:14 PM

give her the truth del....

Neo

12-30-2004, 04:17 PM

How indestructible are the so-called "Black Boxes"?
Each airplane is equipped with a Flight Data Recorder and a Cockpit Voice Recorded. The term "Black Box" is used for these pieces of equipment. The National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) web site gives valuable information regarding these devices.

Regarding the Cockpit Voice Recorder it says:
"The CVR records the flight crew's voices, as well as other sounds inside the cockpit. The recorder's "cockpit area microphone" is usually located on the overhead instrument panel between the two pilots. Sounds of interest to an investigator could be engine noise, stall warnings, landing gear extension and retraction, and other clicks and pops. From these sounds, parameters such as engine rpm, system failures, speed, and the time at which certain events occur can often be determined. Communications with Air Traffic Control, automated radio weather briefings, and conversation between the pilots and ground or cabin crew are also recorded."
http://www.ntsb.gov/aviation/CVR_FDR.htm

They are meant to be the hardy and sure way to get information regarding the last minutes before the plane went down. Here are the specifications of these devices including what they can withstand:

FLIGHT DATA RECORDER
Time recorded: 25 hour continuous Number of parameters: 5 - 300+ Impact tolerance: 3400Gs /6.5ms Fire resistance: 1100 degC/30 min Water pressure resistance: submerged 20,000 ft Underwater locator beacon: 37.5 KHz Battery: 6yr shelf life 30 day operation

COCKPIT VOICE RECORDER
Time recorded: 30 min continuous, 2 hours for solid state digital units Number of channels: 4 Impact tolerance: 3400 Gs /6.5ms Fire resistance: 1100 deg C /30 min Water pressure resistance: submerged 20,000 ft Underwater locator beacon: 37.5 KHz Battery: 6yr shelf life 30 day operation

These specifications indicate equipment which can survive just about any conditions and any crash. Indeed, Black Boxes have been recovered from crashes in swamps, mountains, and oceans.

ABC News reports:
"Although investigators look for an entire black box, sometimes the only parts of the device that survive are the recorder's crash-survivable memory units (CSMU). THE CSMU IS ALMOST INDESTRUCTABLE. It is housed within a stainless-steel shell that contains titanium or aluminum and a high-temperature insulation of dry silica material."

"It is designed to withstand HEAT OF UP TO 2,000 DEGREES FAHRENHEIT FOR ONE HOUR, salt water for at least 30 days, immersion in a variety of liquids such as jet fuel and lubricants, AND AN IMPACT OF 3,400 G's. By comparison, astronauts are typically exposed to up to six Gs during a shuttle takeoff."

So the Black Box is designed to withstand an impact of 3,400 G's. So what about the Pennsylvania crash site?

"THE VOICE RECORDER WAS SAID TO BE HEAVILY DAMAGED, and the manufacturer was being asked to help with further analysis. The plane that crashed in Pennsylvania was reported to have hit the ground in excess of 500 MILES PER HOUR." The plane hit the ground at 500 mph. Taking the weight of the plane, its speed of descent, the G's end up much, much lower than 3,400.

Since each plane has two seperate Black Boxes which are designed to be indestructable in the event of a tragedy, that makes a total of EIGHT BLACK BOXES. If we are to believe that all the Black Boxes were damaged beyond use, then that is to say EIGHT BLACK BOXES in total were destroyed, while a measley paper passport survived.

Then the final paragraph of the same article says: "Investigators are less confident they will recover the black boxes buried underneath the rubble of the World Trade Center." So there is no hope of recovering the virtually indestructable Black Box from the rubble, but a paper passport survives in such a perfect state that it is "a significant piece of evidence"? CNN reports one of the hijackers passports was found in the rubble of the World Trade Center vicinity:

http://edition.cnn.com/2001/US/09/17/inv.investigation.terrorism/index.html
http://edition.cnn.com/2001/US/09/16/gen.america.under.attack/index.html

"The searchers found several clues, he said, but would not elaborate. Last week, a passport belonging to one of the hijackers was found in the vicinity of Vesey Street, near the World Trade Center. 'It was a significant piece of evidence for us,' Mawn said."

"In New York, several blocks from the ruins of the World Trade Center, a passport authorities said belonged to one of the hijackers was discovered a few days ago, according to city Police Commissioner Bernard Kerik." Aside from the idiocy of any suggestion that a passport would survive a plane crash that is allegedly so severe it destroys the virtually indestructable Black Box, we are also led to believe that the passport "flew away", out of the hijackers pocket, down a few blocks from the WTC grounds. Why a few blocks away? Could it be because it was a place out of everyone's sight?

Neo

12-30-2004, 04:18 PM

Neo

12-30-2004, 04:29 PM

Continued 9/11 Story:

It is also well known that paper was strewn all over the scene of the plane crash. This was due to the sudden shattering of the windows which would immediately eject all paper materials out of the building before incineration. A passport in someone's pocket who is sitting on a plane that explodes will suffer the same fate as the person whose pocket it is in, and the plane they are sitting in: absolute cremation.

United Airlines flight 93 crashed into a field in Pennsylvania. There was no explosion and no impact into a building and no 100+ story towers crashed down on top of it. Yet, we are led to believe that both of its Black Boxes were destroyed and/or damaged beyond use as well.

Other airline tragedies also reveal that in each and every case the Black Box is recovered, albeit damaged, but with full usability. Such crashes include EgyptAir flight 990, a 767, and TWA flight 800, a 747. Both crashes resulted in tremendous compromise of the planes physical integrity, but in spite of this the Cockpit Voice Recorders were recovered.

So we have established that the survival of a passport of someone in an exploded plane is lunacy. However, for the sake of argument lets say the passport survived. If the passport did indeed survive then so did the Black Box. If the Black Box did indeed survive as we have proven beyond a shred of doubt, then why the complete and utter lie that it was damaged beyond use? What are they hiding? This will be dealt with irrefutably in the next section of this analysis into the corruption which has seeped into the U.S. government, its foreign policy and its intelligence services.

This analysis has just begun, yet any sound minded person is already forced to question the validity of this entire farce. I intend to dismantle this investigation piece by piece as time allows. If the American people are so concerned with finding justice, why aren't more exposing these inconsistencies, fabrications and outright lies as I have? Do we Americans want JUSTICE SERVED or do we want MORE BLOOD of innocent civilians? Thus far, in the United States of America, due to the anger over the tragedy dubbed "PENTTBOM", there have been at least three homicidal attacks against immigrants. Now an overwhelming 80% of them are supporting an invasion into a remote country that has absolutely nothing to do with this tragedy. Instead of using their heads to get to the bottom of this and prosecute the criminals behind this act, they are killing their neighbors, and laying the heads of good American soldiers and innocent Afghan women and children on the chopping block. I say "them" at this point and not "us", because I distance myself from those who commit hate crimes in the name of "America" whom I have just described. Someone is playing a very sick game upon us all right under our noses, and it will cost us our very lives if we do not STOP them.

ABC News reports: "...And 69 percent say they'd support military action even if it means a long war with substantial U.S. military casualties."

You want "substantial U.S. military casualties"? What the hell is wrong with everyone? The Afghans have never lost a war in 800 years. They not only drove the Russians out of their country but it lead to the dissolution of the Soviet Empire. They have brought empire after empire to their knees. In a CNN interview with Jill Dougherty, Leo Korolkov who trained the Russian Special Forces (equivalent of our Delta Force) said he saw Afghans shot to ribbons and ripped to pieces still charging at them. In his words: "These fighters can bring any country, even a superpower -- be it Russia, the United States or Europe -- to the brink of catastrophe."

Here's a comment from someone that is familiar with these "Black Boxes"

"I have dealt with the manufacture of military hot section parts for 25+ years. I know the alloys that are used. I know their cost and their worth as scrap metal. I also know that the alloys used in the manufacture of the Black Boxes are of this type material. Very well, you say. But so what? ... there is more to it...

I have seen these black boxes and also their contents. They are incredibly simple - but incredibly ingenious. Picture a pile of newspapers or magazines in the dump, in a fire, only the outer edges are damaged-after years of sitting. They are made of P A P E R. The black boxes are made of extremely strong and resilient materials. More importantly, the material that holds the information is not what the FBI would like you to know about.

This material is made of the most indestructible alloys known to man. They can take temperatures over 2000 Deg. F and never know that they had been hot! They can survive salt water immersion for a lot longer (years) than investigators would let them lay there. (They are usually found within a few days.) But most importantly, they are not simple tapes or cassettes made of plastic, but they are thin strips of this "hot-section" type "super" alloy.

The same type as used in the afterburner sections of the F-15's and F-16's--the parts that get white hot, over, and over, and over and still keeps on working.

But - and here is the beginning of what is truly brilliant, they are marked with a stylus not so much different than that of our old 33 1/3 vinyl albums, but in reverse. The information is scribed into this alloy along with timing "nicks" for time/date reference. Here comes the good part: Now, the marked strip is "rolled" up into a continuous roll of high temperature alloy that by design only allows the EDGES of the roll to be exposed to damage (THE DATA ARE IN THE CENTER OF THE STRIP), while the mass of the continuous strip shields the "whole" from damage. What we have is a nearly indestructible roll of data material inside of a nearly indestructible box that is not unlike the magazines or newspaper that survives years of exposure and can still be read as P A P E R!!!!

So, when the FBI tells us that the boxes were nearly destroyed--you can think perhaps...BUT, during their near destruction (or even total destruction), they did what they were designed to do--to protect the metal roll that by design is nearly indestructible by itself. NO DATA?--BALONEY!!!!!!!"

As for what Israel had to say about the 9/11 attacks:

"On the day of the 9-11 attacks, former Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu was asked what the attack would mean for US-Israeli relations. His quick reply was: "It's very good…….Well, it's not good, but it will generate immediate sympathy (for Israel)"

Neo

12-30-2004, 04:37 PM

See where this is heading?

It's looking more and more towards the Israelis than Osama Bin Laden.

As we get deeper into it, it's starting to look more and more like a joint operation between the US/Israel. The destruction of the Flight Data Recorders, bogus hijackers, fake passports and everything else that was concocted by the DOJ (Dept. of Justice) and FBI.

For anyone that thinks I'm reaching, look at the following link and tell me why we shouldn't ask questions.

http://www.newseum.org/frontpages/911/images/oh_abj.jpg

Neo

12-30-2004, 04:54 PM

Liberating America From Israel
Nine-eleven would not have occurred if the U.S. government had refused to help Israel humiliate and destroy Palestinian society. Few express this conclusion publicly, but many believe it is the truth. I believe the catastrophe could have been prevented if any U.S. president during the past 35 years had had the courage and wisdom to suspend all U.S. aid until Israel withdrew from the Arab land seized in the 1967 Arab-Israeli war.

The U.S. lobby for Israel is powerful and intimidating, but any determined president - even President Bush this very day - could prevail and win overwhelming public support for the suspension of aid by laying these facts before the American people:

Israel's present government, like its predecessors, is determined to annex the West Bank - biblical Judea and Samaria - so Israel will become Greater Israel. Ultra-Orthodox Jews, who maintain a powerful role in Israeli politics, believe the Jewish Messiah will not come until Greater Israel is a reality. Although a minority in Israel, they are committed, aggressive, and influential. Because of deep religious conviction, they are determined to prevent Palestinians from gaining statehood on any part of the West Bank.

In its violent assaults on Palestinians, Israel uses the pretext of eradicating terrorism, but its forces are actually engaged advancing the territorial expansion just cited. Under the guise of anti-terrorism, Israeli forces treat Palestinians worse than cattle. With due process nowhere to be found, hundreds are detained for long periods and most are tortured. Some are assassinated. Homes, orchards, and business places are destroyed. Entire cities are kept under intermittent curfew, some confinements lasting for weeks. Injured or ill Palestinians needing emergency medical care are routinely held at checkpoints for an hour or more. Many children are undernourished. The West Bank and Gaza have become giant concentration camps. None of this could have occurred without U.S. support. Perhaps Israeli officials believe life will become so unbearable that most Palestinians will eventually leave their ancestral homes.

Once beloved worldwide, the U.S. government finds itself reviled in most countries because it provides unconditional support of Israeli violations of the United Nations Charter, international law, and the precepts of all major religious faiths.

How did the American people get into this fix?

Nine-eleven had its principal origin 35 years ago when Israel's U.S. lobby began its unbroken success in stifling debate about the proper U.S. role in the Arab-Israeli conflict and effectively concealed from public awareness the fact that the U.S. government gives massive uncritical support to Israel.

Thanks to the suffocating influence of Israel's U.S. lobby, open discussion of the Arab-Israeli conflict has been non-existent in our government all these years. I have firsthand knowledge, because I was a member of the House of Representatives Foreign Affairs Committee in June 1967 when Israeli military forces took control of the Golan Heights, a part of Syria, as well as the Palestinian West Bank and Gaza. I continued as a member for 16 years and to this day maintain a close watch on Congress.

For 35 years, not a word has been expressed in that committee or in either chamber of Congress that deserves to be called debate on Middle East policy. No restrictive or limiting amendments on aid to Israel have been offered for 20 years, and none of the few offered in previous years received more than a handful of votes. On Capitol Hill, criticism of Israel, even in private conversation, is all but forbidden, treated as downright unpatriotic, if not anti-Semitic. The continued absence of free speech was assured when those few who spoke out-Senators Adlai Stevenson and Charles Percy, and Reps. Paul "Pete" McCloskey, Cynthia McKinney, Earl Hilliard, and myself-were defeated at the polls by candidates heavily financed by pro-Israel forces.

As a result, legislation dealing with the Middle East has been heavily biased in favor of Israel and against Palestinians and other Arabs year after year. Home constituencies, misled by news coverage equally lop-sided in Israel's favor, remain largely unaware that Congress behaves as if it were a subcommittee of the Israeli parliament.

However, the bias is widely noted beyond America, where most news media candidly cover Israel's conquest and generally excoriate America's complicity and complacency. When President Bush welcomed Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, sometimes called the Butcher of Beirut, as "my dear friend" and "a man of peace" after Israeli forces, using U.S.-donated arms, completed their devastation of the West Bank last spring, worldwide anger against American policy reached the boiling point.

The fury should surprise no one who reads foreign newspapers or listens to BBC. In several televised statements long before 9/11,Osama bin Laden, believed by U.S. authorities to have masterminded 9/11, cited U.S. complicity in Israel's destruction of Palestinian society as a principal complaint. Prominent foreigners, in and out of government, express their opposition to U.S. policies with unprecedented frequency and severity, especially since Bush announced his determination to make war against Iraq.

The lobby's intimidation remains pervasive. It seems to reach every government center and even houses of worship and revered institutions of higher learning. It is highly effective in silencing the many U.S. Jews who object to the lobby's tactics and Israel's brutality.

Nothing can justify 9/11. Those guilty deserve maximum punishment, but it makes sense for America to examine motivations promptly and as carefully as possible. Terrorism almost always arises from deeply-felt grievances. If they can be eradicated or eased, terrorist passions are certain to subside.

Today, a year after 9/11, President Bush has made no attempt to redress grievances, or even to identify them. In fact, he has made the scene far worse by supporting Israel's religious war against Palestinians, an alliance that has intensified anti-American anger. He seems oblivious to the fact that nearly two billion people worldwide regard the plight of Palestinians as today's most important foreign-policy challenge. No one in authority will admit a calamitous reality that is skillfully shielded from the American people but clearly recognized by most of the world: America suffered 9/11 and its aftermath and may soon be at war with Iraq, mainly because U.S. policy in the Middle East is made in Israel, not in Washington.

Israel is a scofflaw nation and should be treated as such. Instead of helping Sharon intensify Palestinian misery, our president should suspend all aid until Israel ends its occupation of Arab land Israel seized in 1967. The suspension would force Sharon's compliance or lead to his removal from office, as the Israeli electorate will not tolerate a prime minister who is at odds with the White House.

If Bush needs an additional reason for doing the right thing, he can justify the suspension as a matter of military necessity, an essential step in winning international support for his war on terrorism. He can cite a worthy precedent. When President Abraham Lincoln issued the proclamation that freed only the slaves in states that were then in rebellion, he make the restriction because of "military necessity."

If Bush suspends U.S. aid, he will liberate all Americans from long years of bondage to Israel's misdeeds.

Neo

12-30-2004, 05:05 PM

Did Israel execute the 9-11 act of war against America?
And should we be bombing Jerusalem and Tel Aviv instead of Baghdad and Kabul? Laura Knight-Jadczyk presents a damning case against both the State of Israel and elements within the American government sympathetic to them. And if Israel is the enemy of America, how many in the government are guilty of treason?

Cloudcroft chief stops Israelis with suspicious cargo
By Michael Shinabery
Staff Writer

CLOUDCROFT — That they were speeding through the school zone first got his attention.
That they had Israeli driver's licenses and expired passports made him suspicious.

Cloudcroft Police Chief Gene Green stopped the 2-ton van on Thursday, for speeding. Initially, Green thought the truck was commercial because of exterior markings. But when he found it was out of Chicago, he asked for documentation such as logs books and manifests.

"They said this is a U-Haul truck and handed me a rental agreement (for) in-town delivery only in Illinois, (which) had expired two days before," Green said.

He called for backup, and Otero County Sheriff's Deputy Billy Anders, who patrols the Sacramento Mountains, arrived, along with Capt. Norbert Sanchez and Det. Eddie Medrano.

"We got them out and started digging a little deeper," Green said, "got permission to search the truck. They claimed they were hauling furniture from Austin to Chicago."

When officers advised the men they were not exactly en route from one town to another, Green said the two men claimed they were Deming bound.

"But they couldn't give us an address in Deming they were going to," he said. "Once we got into the truck, they had some junk furniture I wouldn't have given to Goodwill."

Also inside the vehicle were, Green said, "50 boxes" they claimed was a "private" delivery, but the men insisted they had no "idea what was in them."

At that point, the officers called for drug-sniffing and bomb-sniffing dogs. The men were turned over to the Immigration and Naturalization Service, and U-Haul recovered the truck. Contents of the boxes remain unknown, pending investigation.

On May 7, 2002, local police authorities pulled over a Budget rental truck in Oak Harbour, Washington near the Whitney Island Naval Air Station. The driver and his passenger were Israeli nationals, one of which had entered the country illegally. The other had an expired visa. Tests performed on the vehicle revealed that there were traces of TNT on the gearshift and RDX plastic explosives on the steering wheel. But no actual explosives were reported to have been found in the truck. [Fox News, 5/13/02]

A report in the Seattle Post-Intelligencer the following day reported that the FBI performed follow-up tests on the truck which turned-up negative. One source speculated that perhaps the original tests had actually detected just cigarette residue, and not explosives. [Seattle Post-Intelligencer, 5/14/02, Jerusalem Post, 5/14/02].
Critics argued that it would make no sense for U.S. authorities to use a method of testing that could be skewed by cigarette residue.

'The specific claim is made that residue from a cigarette lighter confused the tests for TNT and RDX. That doesn't explain why the trained bomb-sniffing dog, who surely knows the difference between explosives and cigarettes [else he would false-positive every smoker, ashtray, and convenience store he came across] gave the first indications of explosives in the truck that led to the tests in the first place. Likewise, were the chemical tests unable to discriminate between tobacco and TNT/RDX, which are chemically quite different from tobacco combustion products, they would give false positive results for every vehicle ever tested in which smokers had ever ridden. Given the likelihood of finding tobacco residues in any car, such tests would have to be designed to tell the difference. The same is true for other products from non- electric cigarette lighters, the vast majority of which are butane.'

The same website also provided references to three documents with detailed information on the tests used to detect TNT and RDX. None of the documents indicated that the presence of cigarette residue might induce inaccurate test results. [International Society for Optical Engineering 1984; Cold Regions and Research Engineering Laboratory 5-1996; Security Management n.d.]

Neo

12-30-2004, 05:10 PM

Continued 9/11 post....

I also remembered another peculiar item: the so-called Urban Moving Company that some researchers suggest was a cover for Mossad.

Many observers have suggested that Israel had foreknowledge of the 9/11 terrorists attacks. Some have even argued that they may have been behind the attacks, and it seems that the funny stories about Israelis with trucks and bad papers just keep popping up here and there.

On September 11, five employees of Jewish owned Urban Moving Company were detained as a result of witness accounts that they were taking pictures of the flaming ruins of the World Trade Center and celebrating!

Yes indeedy! Shortly after the collapse of the towers a witness called the police and reported that the 5 individuals were, 'going to unusual lengths to photograph the World Trade Center ruins' and they were obviously and blatantly 'making light of the situation.' The witness stated that these men were on the roof of the office of their employer, Urban Moving Company, and were posing, dancing, and laughing. [New York Times 10/8/01; Bergen Record 9/12/01; Ha'aretz 9/17/01; Gotham Gazette 11/2/01]

After their indiscreet celebration on the roof of the building, the five Israelis headed down to a nearby parking lot where they mounted the roof of their truck and resumed their photographing and celebrating. Another witness called the police and told them that the men were smiling, dancing, and giving each other high-fives while viewing the destruction of the symbol of Free Enterprise in America. [Gotham Gazette 11/2/01; ABC News, 6/21/02]

A few hours later, the five Israelis were stopped by police while driving their truck. One individual had $4,700 in cash hidden in his sock, while another had two foreign passports. They were also found to be in the possession of a box- cutter, which they presumably had because of their job as professional movers. [New York Times 10/8/01; Gotham Gazette 11/2/01; ABC News, 6/21/02]

On September 14, Dominic Suter, the owner of the moving company, left the country very abruptly after FBI agents indicated that they wanted a second interview with him. According to ABC News 20-20 [ABC News 6/21/02], 'Three months later 20-20's cameras photographed the inside of Urban Moving, and it looked as if the business had been shut down in a big hurry. Cell phones were lying around; office phones were still connected; and the property of dozens of clients remained in the warehouse. The owner had also cleared out of his New Jersey home, put it up for sale and returned with his family to Israel.' [New Jersey Department of Law and Public Safety, 12/13/01; Gotham Gazette 11/2/01; ABC News, 6/21/02; Forward, 3/15/02]

Shortly after the arrest of the men, FBI officials suspected that the Urban Moving company was an Israeli intelligence front. Vince Cannistraro, a former chief of operations for counterterrorism, told ABC News that the FBI was concerned that the moving company had been 'set up or exploited for the purpose of launching an intelligence operation against radical Islamists in the area, particularly in the New Jersey-New York area.' [ABC News, 6/21/02]

The five employees that were taken into custody were all former members of the Israeli Army. After being transferred to jail, the FBIís Criminal Division sent the case to the Counterintelligence Section on account of suspicions that they were Israeli spies. They were then detained for more that two months. Some of them spent 40 days in solitary confinement. [New York Times 11/21/01; ABC News, 6/21/02]

Naturally, several individuals attempted to research this item. One high-ranking U.S. intelligence source told Forward magazine that intelligence agents' investigation of Urban Moving Company led them to believe it was a front for the Israeli Mossad. It should be noted that, at present there is no publicly available information that conclusively confirms this allegation. However the above described incident, reported by various news sources, certainly casts a very dark shadow of suspicion on the company and its employees.

It seems that Urban Moving Company was not an isolated phenomenon. According to a small local newspaper in Pennsylvania, The Mercury, three Israeli employees working for Moving Systems, Inc. were detained by police on October 11, 2001, after being caught illegally dumping garbage from their moving truck into the dumpster of a restaurant. The suspects had fled the seen after being confronted by the restaurantís manager, who immediately reported the incident to the police. [The Mercury 10/17/01]

The Mercury reported: 'The area was searched by township police, and the vehicle was spotted parked on the curb in front of John Kennedy Ford on Ridge Pike, just west of Industrial Way. An officer proceeded to make contact with the occupants of the truck by knocking on the cab, according to reports.

A Middle Eastern [an Israeli according to Executive Intelligence Review 3/29/02] man, later identified as Ron Katar, 23, exited the sleeper area of the cab and said that the operator - Elmakias - was across the street as he pointed toward the Don Rosen Porsche dealer, reports said.
Elmakias and a white female, Ayelet Reisler, 23, were approaching the vehicle from the dealership, but the female then began walking in a different direction, acting as if she were not with Elmakias, according to reports. . . .

'Elmakias said that his destination was New York and that he was also coming from New York. He said he was in Plymouth because he was supposed to make a pickup from a male in the morning and pointed toward the Storage USA facility on Belvoir Road and West Ridge Pike, police said. Elmakias could not, however, provide a name or telephone number of the customer.' [The Mercury 10/17/01]

A search of the truck turned up detailed video footage of the Sears Towers along with several other suspicious articles. It was also discovered that the driver of the truck had falsified his driver log.

As of this date, no ties to Israeli intelligence have been made. [The Mercury 10/17/01]

Then, of course, there was the "Art Scandal." It seems that Israeli art students - Israelis posing as art students selling their art [actually made in China], - were suspected of spying for Israel. They were detained by the FBI and later deported to Israel on account of visa violations. The FBI first took notice of them in January of 2001.

A highly detailed DEA report that was acquired by French intelligence analysts documented 180 cases of Israeli art students infiltrating DEA facilities. It provided names, drivers' license numbers, addresses and phone numbers of the Israelis. [DEA report 6/01; Insight 3/11/02]

Despite official confirmations of the report, other U.S. officials denied its existence. In response, Intelligence Online released the document to CreativeLoafing.com who published it on the Internet for the public. [DEA report 6/01] The Associated Press also reported that it had a copy [AP 3/9/02] The report acknowledged that the art students 'may well be an organized intelligence-gathering activity.' [DEA report 6/01; AP 3/5/02; Sun Sentinel 3/7/02]

Bill Carter, a spokesman for the FBI, said, 'After an agency reported suspicious activities by those so-called students, the FBI conducted an investigation and determined that there was no credence to the assumption that this was an Israeli spying operation. None of the Israelis were charged with espionage and they were all deported by the INS for visa violations.' [Forward 3/15/02]

Now, here is where things get VERY INTERESTING! You see, five of the so-called Israeli Art Students that weren't really art students, had been living at 4220 Sheridan St in Hollywood, Florida.

What is so interesting about that address?
It just so happens that four of the five so-called 9/11 hijackers that were on AA Flight 11 [Mohammed Atta, Abdulaziz Al-Omari, Walid and WaÔl Al- Shehri] and one of the five hijackers [Marwan Al-Shehhi] from UA Flight 175 had at one time or another also resided in Hollywood, Florida. Where in Hollywood?

Why, it just happens that Mohammed Atta, the presumed lead hijacker had lived at 3389 Sheridan St, only a few blocks away from the Fake Israeli Art Students! [Le Monde 3/5/02; Reuters 3/5/02; Jane's Intelligence Digest, 3/15/02; Salon, 5/7/02]

Well, don't that just beat all! And to think, Florida Senator Bob Graham was having breakfast with Pakistani ISI chief Mahmoud-Ahmad on the morning of September 11 - the same ISI chief who was later linked to Mohammed Atta by virtue of the fact that he transferred a LOT of money to the guy.

Hmmm... I smell a rat somewhere!

Neo

12-30-2004, 05:12 PM

Continued from last post....

Of course, the Israelis have a good reason for this: they were "investigating terrorists!" We are assured by German news sources that: 'between December 2000 and April 2001 a whole horde of Israeli counter-terror investigators, posing as students, followed the trails of Arab terrorists and their cells in the United States. In their secret investigations, the Israelis came very close to the later perpetrators of Sept. 11. In the town of Hollywood, Florida, they identified the two former Hamburg students and later terror pilots Mohammed Atta and Marwan al-Shehhi as possible terrorists. Agents lived in the vicinity of the apartment of the two seemingly normal flight school students, observing them around the clock.' [Der Spiegel 10/1/02]

I guess they didn't observe them "around the clock" enough to see when they were getting on those planes that were hijacked. A failure of intelligence? What's more, this truly pathetic "explanation" doesn't explain the joy of the Israelis at the collapse of the World Trade Center Towers, nor why Bob Graham was having breakfast with the guy who paid off Mohammed Atta...

Well, it gets deeper: In addition to the close proximity of the Israeli art students to the Florida-based hijackers, other art students in Texas, California, and Arkansas were operating close to several of the other hijackers suspected of taking part in the 9-11 attacks. [DEA report 6/01]

And if that doesn't just crumble your cookies, how about the fact that six of the students had mobile phones that had been purchased by a former Israeli vice consul in the U.S.? [Le Monde 3/5/02]

The passports of the students revealed that they had been visitors in several different countries including, Thailand, Laos, India, Kenya, Central and South America, Australia, Germany, the Netherlands and Canada. [Insight 3/11/02]

In spite of the findings of the DEA report, the students were deported back to Israel on account of visa violations. [AP 3/5/02] Now, let me try to understand this: at that point in time when every single American citizen was subject to being a suspected terrorist, a gang of Israelis with "SPY" practically branded on their foreheads, were simply shipped home with NO QUESTIONS ASKED?!

EXCUSE ME?!

Well, anyway, back to the problem at hand: It just so happens that Israeli suspects appear to know when they are being investigated.

In several investigations of Israeli suspects, the suspects quickly modified their behavior after U.S. enforcement agencies began wiretapping them. This suggests that the suspects may have known that they were being monitored. [Fox News 12/12-13/01]

In other words, either somebody very high in the U.S. government is warning them when those silly lower level bureaucrats get nosey. Either that, or there is a major mole in the U.S. intelligence services.

According to Executive Intelligence Review, 'A well-placed Washington source has alerted EIR that there is growing suspicion among U.S. government law enforcement and intelligence agencies that Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has dispatched special operations teams into North America. The warning came in the context of a discussion about the recent deportation of five Israelis who were detained on Sept. 11 for suspicious behavior.

Neo

12-30-2004, 05:17 PM

Continued from last post...

"Portions of the funds garnered from the illegal operations, according to sources, are funneled to offshore bank accounts of Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon. Some of these dirty funds were reportedly diverted to Sharon's election campaigns. This Israeli mafia apparatus receives technical support via a number of Israeli communications firms, that subcontract with major American telephone companies and government law enforcement agencies" [EIR 12/13/01]

What does seem to be true is that, in spite of the U.S. federal agency claims that "there is no Israeli spy network," several of the same federal agencies have in the past year taken steps to protect themselves against espionage! It seems that things were getting mighty sticky because the U.S. Office of the National Counterintelligence Executive officially warned federal employees in March 2001 about the art students and urged them to report any contact with such art students! The warning read, 'These individuals have been described as aggressive. They attempt to engage employees in conversation rather than giving a sales pitch.' [Insight 3/11/02; AP 3/9/02; Forward 3/15/02]

What seems to be emerging as the obvious solution to this mystery is that there is both high level U.S. government complicity AND a major mole in the U.S. intelligence services.

DEA communications employees were put on alert. According to John Sugg, 'a Dec. 18 e-mail among DEA communications employees makes clear that the agency underwent self-scrutiny as the ëresult of the Fox network expose on Israeli counterintelligence activitiesí.' [Creative Loafing, Atlanta 3/27/02]

Pentagon and DOD ended practice of awarding foreign companies contracts involving sensitive projects. The World Tribune [World Tribune 3/12/02] reported, 'Israeli nationals could be banned from participating in U.S. defense contracts under new regulations that seek to keep foreigners out of sensitive projects.' The article revealed that these restrictions were specifically targeted at 'IT' and other 'computer-related' contracts.

On December 13, 2001 the EIR's Washington Bureau Chief Bill Jones asked Colin Powell, 'There were 60 Israeli citizens who have been picked up in the post- Sept. 11 sweep, many of whom, if not all of whom, are connected to Israeli intelligence. Are you concerned about such intelligence operations on U.S. soil, and have you taken up this issue with your counterpart in Israel?'

Powell responded: 'I'm aware that some Israeli citizens have been detained, and I've been in touch with the Israeli government as to the fact that they have been detained, in making sure that they have rights of access to Israeli diplomatic personnel here in the United States. With respect to why they are being detained, and the other aspects of your question, whether it's because they are in intelligence services or what things they were doing, I will defer to the Department of Justice and the FBI to answer that; because, frankly, I deal with the consular parts of that problem, not the intelligence or law-enforcement parts of that problem.' [Fox News 12/17/01; EIR 12/28/01]
Justice Department Susan Dryden, spokesperson, referring to the numerous articles citing the leaked DEA report, claimed, 'At this time, we have no information to support this.' [Le Monde 3/5/02; AP 3/9/02; Fox News Service 3/5/01]

Ms. Dryden went even further to say that the story was 'an urban myth that has been circulating for months. The department has no information at this time to substantiate these widespread reports about Israeli art students involved in espionage.' [Washington Post, 3/6/02]

According to one independent journalist who was investigating the art students a CIA officer had told him, 'We've just closed the book on it. And I recommend that you do the same.' [Salon, 5/7/02]

Whoa! Now what's THAT supposed to mean? Is that a threat?! Again I ask why law-abiding American citizens must submit to the loss of all their constitutional freedoms while very suggestive evidence exists that Israel may be a responsible party in the 9-11 attacks is "closed" to scrutiny?

One official of the present administration stated that the 'evidence linking these Israelis to 9-11 is classified. I cannot tell you about evidence that has been gathered. It's classified information.' [Fox News 12/12-13/01]

Which brings up the question as to why the Bush Administration is not only blocking an unbiased investigation into the events of September 11, but are also stalling on releasing the reports that HAVE been assembled? What do they REALLY have to hide?

Well, maybe the following provides a clue: Pro-Israeli director of the Middle East Forum Daniel Pipes wrote an op-ed piece asserting that the whole espionage story was just a myth.í In spite of all the above evidence, he claimed the story was baseless and amounted to little more than fodder for the conspiracy theorists. [New York Post 3/11/02]

Critical media coverage of investigations into Israelis has been virtually non-existent. The major media, with the exception of Fox News, completely ignored the Israeli spy scandal. But Fox soon canned the story under pressure for pro-Israeli lobbies. Well, that's not a surprise considering that Jews control the media in the U.S. As Kevin MacDonald has written:

I guess warnings to "close the book" carry a lot of weight. Salon reported, 'Oddly, four days after the Cameron investigation ran, all traces of his report -- transcripts, Web links, headlines -- disappeared from the Foxnews.com archives. [Normally, Fox leaves a story up for two to three weeks before consigning it to the pay archive.]

Neo

12-30-2004, 05:19 PM

Continued from last post...

Asked why the Cameron piece disappeared, spokesman Robert Zimmerman said it was up there on our Web site for about two or three weeks and then it was taken down because we had to replace it with more breaking news. As you know, in a Web site you've got x amount of bandwidth -- you know, x amount of stuff you can put stuff up on [sic]. So it was replaced. Normal course of business, my friend.

When informed that Cameron's story was gone from the archives, not simply from the headline pages [when you entered the old URL, a Fox screen appeared with the message "This story no longer exists"], Zimmerman replied, "I don't know where it is." [Salon, 5/7/02]

Le Monde, attempted 3 times to acquire the transcripts from Fox. The requests were ignored until February 26, when Fox explained that there was some sort of problem preventing them from sending it. The 'problem' was not explained. [Le Monde 3/5/02; see also Salon, 5/7/02]

Several pro-Israeli organizations put pressure on Fox to halt its probe and retract its story.
In response to the Fox News stories, the Israeli embassy stated the following, 'The report on Fox News contains no quoted source, it has in no way demonstrated anything more than anonymous innuendo, and should be regarded accordingly. Israel does not spy on the United States of America.' [Jerusalem Post, 5/14/02]

In response to the DEA report that was publicized by Intelligence Online, a spokesperson at the Israeli embassy in Washington claimed, 'No one in the US is taking this story seriously. I categorically deny the claims and my embassy has received no complaints from the US. . . . I am not aware of a single Israeli who has been charged with espionage.' [Independent 3/6/02]

Forward, after initially denying the allegations of an Israeli spy ring, acknowledged its existence in mid March 2002, [Forward, 12/21/01] but claimed, 'far from pointing to Israeli spying against US government and military facilities, as reported in Europe last week, the incidents in question appear to represent a case of Israelis in the United States spying on a common enemy, radical Islamic networks suspected of links to Middle East terrorism.' [Forward, 3/15/02]

This, of course, begs the question as to why 9-11 occurred if the "Israeli spy-ring" was "on top of things," so to say. It also begs the question as to why individuals who are suggestively implicated in such a spy ring were doing the Happy Dance when the WTC towers fell?

August 23, 2001: According to German newspapers, the Mossad gave the CIA a list of 19 terrorists living in the US and said that it appeared that they were planning to carry out an attack in the near future. It is unknown if these are the same exact 19 names as the actual hijackers or if the number is a coincidence. However, at least four names did refer to actual 9/11 hijackers: Nawaf Alhazmi, Khalid Almihdhar, Marwan Alshehhi, and Mohamed Atta. [Die Zeit, 10/1/02, Der Spiegel, 10/1/02, BBC, 10/2/02, Haaretz, 10/3/02]

The Mossad appears to have learned about this through their "art student" spy ring; the same "art student spy ring" that the U.S. government warned their agencies to beware.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So what's the story? Is there an Israeli spy ring that the U.S. is trying to circumvent? Or is there an Israeli spy ring that tries to cooperate with the U.S.? If they are cooperating, that begs the question as to why the purported "warning and list" was not treated as particularly urgent by the CIA and also were not passed on to the FBI.

Would that constitute a "failure of intelligence?" Or criminal negligence? The next item, however, suggests complicity.

It is not clear if this warning influenced the adding of Alhazmi and Almihdhar's names to a terrorism watch list on this same day, and if so, why only those two. [Der Spiegel, 10/1/02]

These details create additional problems since Israel continues to deny that there were any Mossad agents in the US. [Haaretz, 10/3/02] and the US has denied knowing about Mohammed Atta before 9/11, despite other media reports to the contrary and despite the fact that Florida Senator Bob Graham was, on the morning of September 11, 2001, having breakfast with the Pakistani ISI chief who was later directly linked to Mohammed Atta.

None of this matter is cut and dried. On September 10, 2001, the Army School of Advanced Military Studies issued a report written by elite US army officers, which was made public just prior to 9/11. The report gave the following description for the Mossad: "Wildcard. Ruthless and cunning. Has capability to target US forces and make it look like a Palestinian/Arab act." [Washington Times, 9/10/01]

Hmmm... I guess that the Bush Gang didn't read that particular item of Intell. They were too busy reading the "cooked intell" that said Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction, I guess.
At this point, things take a strange turn. With all the questions about an Israeli Spy Ring being brought up again and again, a neat solution has been found: They aren't really Israelis! They are Islamic terrorists PRETENDING to be Israelis!

EIR reported that a number of the Israelis that were detained after the terrorist attacks 'have been linked to suspected ëIslamicí terrorist cells in southern California' [EIR 1/11/02]

As it happens, we had our own experiences with a "Moving Company" with what turned out to be extremely questionable status: Globe Movers, purportedly owned by a couple named Baruch (Barry) and Megan Karpick. I will be chronicling this in an upcoming chapter of The French Connection, but let me just say that the recent months - as a consequence of this very disturbing interaction - have really made me think about the Jewish/Islamic question in a different way.

Here is another interesting item along that line from awhile back that ought to give us pause:
On January 12, 2000, 11 Islamic preachers were detained in India prior to boarding a flight headed for Dhaka, Bangladesh on suspicions of being terrorists. Although, the Indian official eventually cleared the clerics to leave, officials in Bangladesh indicated that they would not grant them visas. The Muslims, who all had Israeli passports, were allowed to board a flight to Israel under Israeli pressure. An Indian intelligence analyst, Ashok Debbarma, explained to The Week, 'It is not unlikely for Mossad to recruit 11 Afghans in Iran and grant them Israeli citizenship to penetrate a network such as Bin Laden's. They would begin by infiltrating them into an Islamic radical group in an unlikely place like Bangladesh.' He added that Israel obvious concern for the men, and the haste with which they were flown back indicated a possible 'aborted operation.' [The Week, 2/6/00]

Neo

12-30-2004, 05:23 PM

Continued from last post...

Now, let's go back a minute to the fact that Senator Bob Graham was having breakfast with the Pakistani ISI chief on the morning of September 11, 2001. Keep in mind that this man, Mahmoud Ahmad, was later linked directly to Mohammed Atta, the purported "head terrorist" of the 9-11 attacks. With that in mind, read the following report in which Pakistan's ex spy chief "blames Mossad" for the 9-11 attacks:

Wednesday, 26 September 2001 15:05 (ET)
By ARNAUD DE BORCHGRAVE, UPI Editor at Large
RAWALPINDI, Pakistan, Sept. 26 (UPI) -- The Sept. 11 terrorist attacks on the United States were perpetrated by renegade U.S. Air Force elements working in conjunction with Mossad, the Israeli intelligence service, according to the retired Pakistani general who is closest to the Taliban and Osama bin Laden.

Gen. Hameed Gul, head of Inter Services Intelligence, the equivalent of a CIA-cum-FBI combination, during the war against the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan, spent two weeks in the war-torn country immediately prior to Sept. 11. He has been acting as "strategic adviser" to Pakistan's extremist religious political parties. Four religious leaders left his house in the army's principal garrison town as this reporter arrived at 9:30 p.m. Tuesday. The interview lasted 90 minutes.

Already countless millions of Muslims believe that the World Trade Center and Pentagon suicide attacks were part of a Mossad plot to force the United States into confrontation with the Muslim world.

[Notice in the next line that what Gul is saying is pronounced to be "disinformation" that those poor, misguided Muslims will actually believe!]

Now Gul has added a new disinformation wrinkle to the plot. And what Gul says or writes is taken at face value by religious leaders and is repeated in thousands of mosques at Friday prayers. In an exclusive interview with United Press International, the fundamentalist general said it is now clear that there was also a plot by U.S. Air Force officers against the Pentagon.

"The twin towers were first attacked at 8:45 a.m.," he said, "and four flights were diverted from their assigned air space, and yet Air Force jets didn't scramble until 10 a.m. That smacks of a small-scale Air Force rebellion, a coup attempt against the Pentagon perhaps? Radars are jammed, transponders fail. No IFF -- friend or foe identification -- challenge ... This was clearly an inside job. (President) Bush was afraid and rushed to the shelter of a nuclear bunker.

"(Bush) clearly feared a nuclear situation. Who could that have been? Will that also be hushed up in the investigation, like the Warren report after the Kennedy assassination?"

Gul said that his friend bin Laden had sworn to him on the Koran that he was not involved.

"From a cave inside a mountain or a peasant's hovel," Gul asked, how could bin Laden mount such a sophisticated operation? "Let's be serious," he said with a smile. "Mossad and its American associates are the obvious culprits," he added by asking, "Who benefits from the crime?"

Asked why Israel would benefit, Gul replied, "Israel knows it has a short shelf-life before it is overwhelmed by demographics (and it) has now handed the (Bush administration) the opportunity it has been waiting for to consolidate America's imperial grip on the Gulf and acquire control of the Caspian basin by extending its military presence in Central Asia."

Bush 43 doesn't realize he is being manipulated by people who understand geopolitics. He is not leading but being led. All he can do is think in terms of the wanted-dead-or-alive culture which is how Hollywood conditions the masses to think and act."

"Bush 43" is actually Washington shorthand for distinguishing President George W. Bush from his father. President George W. Bush is the 43rd president: George Bush Sr. was the 41st.
Gul admitted that he turned against America when the United States walked away from Afghanistan following the Soviet withdrawal in 1989.

"We were all pro-American (during the war) but then America left us in the lurch and everything went to pieces, including Afghanistan."

Asked to consider the possibility that bin Laden -- or OBL as he is referred to in Pakistani conversations -- was lying to him and is indeed guilty as charged by the United States, Gul said, "If Taliban ar