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Question for atheists...

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436 replies to this topic

#1
cocky4ever

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If we discover life elsewhere in the universe, do you think it would strengthen the argument against atheism??

Based on our best estimates, the chances of the universe randomly happening into what we see today is incredibly low.

But even if we attirubte that to chance, and say we just lucked into a universe suitable for life...the odds of life randomly occurring is once again insanely low.

So if we discover life elsewhere would you view that as a blow to atheism? Or would you just consider it another insanely improbable occurrence that randomly happened?

#2
msubulldogfan1

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If you subscribe to the multiverse theory, then a universe suitable life was not just possible but almost guaranteed.

#3
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My God can do anything he wants to do. If he wants to put life on more than one planet that is nothing more than his decision to do so.
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#4
cocky4ever

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View Postmsubulldogfan1, on 12 March 2014 - 06:33 AM, said:

If you subscribe to the multiverse theory, then a universe suitable life was not just possible but almost guaranteed.

But that doesn't change the idea that the odds of ending up in one are extremely low. Or the fact that the odds of life randomly occurring are extremely low. So, if we discover life elsewhere that would mean we would have discovered two examples in our extremely low sample size. So either you would say it randomly happened somewhere else( insanely low probability) or that life it somehow got from one planet to the other(meteorites??) which again seems like a rather low probability.

#5
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#6
A. Pilgrim

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It could be turned back around...

If life is discovered elsewhere in the universe, what does that say about Jesus as savior?
Did Jesus only come to save humans?
Would that imply a different savior for other planets?
If Jesus were the savior for all life in the universe, then how could the other life have ever heard about Jesus' sacrifice in order to accept Him?
Or, if you're a staunch believer in the literal Creationist story, maybe you don't think other life is not subject to the same requirements because they didn't necessarily 'eat of the forbidden fruit'?

In my opinion, there are many more potential issues within Christian doctrine if life on another planet were discovered than with an atheistic belief structure.

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#7
cocky4ever

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View PostA. Pilgrim, on 12 March 2014 - 07:28 AM, said:

It could be turned back around...

If life is discovered elsewhere in the universe, what does that say about Jesus as savior?
Did Jesus only come to save humans?
Would that imply a different savior for other planets?
If Jesus were the savior for all life in the universe, then how could the other life have ever heard about Jesus' sacrifice in order to accept Him?
Or, if you're a staunch believer in the literal Creationist story, maybe you don't think other life is not subject to the same requirements because they didn't necessarily 'eat of the forbidden fruit'?

In my opinion, there are many more potential issues within Christian doctrine if life on another planet were discovered than with an atheistic belief structure.

Probably...but wouldn't it also be problematic for atheists given that they keep attributing things to chance when the chances are so small?

Edited by cocky4ever, 12 March 2014 - 07:34 AM.


#8
A. Pilgrim

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View Postcocky4ever, on 12 March 2014 - 07:34 AM, said:

Probably...but wouldn't it also be problematic for atheists given that they keep attributing things to chance when the chances are so small?

Um, not really. Because when you talk about the universe and where it "ends" (if it does...) then how can we say the chances are small?

In essence- we cannot know the 'chances' of life occurring on two separate planets in a universe whose bounds we do not know currently.
If the universe extends infinitely...then how can we assume the chances to be small?

Edited by A. Pilgrim, 12 March 2014 - 07:37 AM.

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#9
A. Pilgrim

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keep in mind, if you were to try and quantify the 'small chances' of life occurring on two different planets within the universe, it doesnt matter if the 'chances' are 20%, 1%, or .0001%...its still a chance.

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#10
GAMECOCK_FAN

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View PostA. Pilgrim, on 12 March 2014 - 07:28 AM, said:

In my opinion, there are many more potential issues within Christian doctrine if life on another planet were discovered than with an atheistic belief structure.
As a Christian, I agree with this completely.  Whcih is why i don't believe there is life like we know it on another planet.  And now, since I don't usually get involved in religious or political discussions on here, I'll bow back out.
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#11
A. Pilgrim

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View PostGAMECOCK_FAN, on 12 March 2014 - 07:49 AM, said:

As a Christian, I agree with this completely.  Whcih is why i don't believe there is life like we know it on another planet.  And now, since I don't usually get involved in religious or political discussions on here, I'll bow back out.

I hope you don't bow out...because I'm curious about your position.

It sounds like you're forming an opinion that is of least resistance to your religious affiliation.

Is that a fair approach to this subject?

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#12
cocky4ever

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View PostA. Pilgrim, on 12 March 2014 - 07:52 AM, said:



I hope you don't bow out...because I'm curious about your position.

It sounds like you're forming an opinion that is of least resistance to your religious affiliation.

Is that a fair approach to this subject?

Isn't that exactly what you're doing(minus religion) when you say you will attribute it to chance, no matter how small the chance is? You're just choosing the belief that offers the least opposition to your current one.

#13
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I am curious as to how many Atheists post on here. I myself am a proud Christian, just completely curious.
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#14
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View Postcocky4ever, on 12 March 2014 - 08:07 AM, said:

Isn't that exactly what you're doing(minus religion) when you say you will attribute it to chance, no matter how small the chance is? You're just choosing the belief that offers the least opposition to your current one.

Nope- and FTR, I'm a Christian, just pointing to the flaws in the assumptions of the OP.

Atheists, for the most part (and from what I know) are rationalists. Faith is irrational, science is rational.

Rationally, if there's even a .0000001% chance of something happening, the rationalist must accept it as a possibility.
You could argue the same for the existence of God- that an atheist cannot KNOW with a certainty that God does not exist, and therefore some chance, however small, must exist. I cannot answer how an atheist would respond to such an approach.

Now, if this thread were geared towards agnostics- then the .0000001% chance thing I could definitely see as convincing them.

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#15
cocky4ever

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View PostA. Pilgrim, on 12 March 2014 - 08:13 AM, said:



Nope- and FTR, I'm a Christian, just pointing to the flaws in the assumptions of the OP.

Atheists, for the most part (and from what I know) are rationalists. Faith is irrational, science is rational.

Rationally, if there's even a .0000001% chance of something happening, the rationalist must accept it as a possibility.
You could argue the same for the existence of God- that an atheist cannot KNOW with a certainty that God does not exist, and therefore some chance, however small, must exist. I cannot answer how an atheist would respond to such an approach.

Now, if this thread were geared towards agnostics- then the .0000001% chance thing I could definitely see as convincing them.


Right, but there is such a thing as statistical zero. And lots of people have pegged the likelihood of our universe as being way beyond statistical zero. I was just wondering last night what it would take for atheists to question their beliefs. If the same person won he lottery every day for the next 50 years would you logically say" well, of course they win every time. That's the universe I live in so I wouldn't know any other way. Doesn't matter how small the odds are." Or would a logical person reach a point where they say " I'm starting to get the feeling that his lottery is rigged."






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