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CAPA - college athletes players union

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56 replies to this topic

#16
Noah

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There's a reality about college football that few folks are willing to explore.  It's not what the NCAA would lead you to believe.


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Formerly known as Noah.Dreams

#17
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View PostNoah, on 30 January 2014 - 09:46 AM, said:

There's a reality about college football that few folks are willing to explore.  It's not what the NCAA would lead you to believe.

This much we can be SURE of.
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#18
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Eagle fan had it right...............if any move is made to "pay" players, then the schools should stop awarding football schollies and pay the players what the tuition would've cost

they'll figure out they're a buncha dumbasses who kicked a gift horse in the mouth then

#19
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View PostHaymaker, on 30 January 2014 - 02:00 PM, said:

Eagle fan had it right...............if any move is made to "pay" players, then the schools should stop awarding football schollies and pay the players what the tuition would've cost

they'll figure out they're a buncha dumbasses who kicked a gift horse in the mouth then
Beat me to the punch.
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#20
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How oblivious do you have to be to think you aren't replaceable?

People would still watch college sports even if these players weren't there.
Dumbasses.

Edited by JoeGator, 30 January 2014 - 02:26 PM.


#21
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View PostJoeGator, on 30 January 2014 - 02:23 PM, said:

How oblivious do you have to be to think you aren't replaceable?

People would still watch college sports even if these players weren't there.
Dumbasses.

I don't know though, a lot of people would stop watching when the Heisman winning running-back was James Whiteman who runs a 4.8




(noracist)
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#22
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View PostTheRealBrave, on 31 January 2014 - 10:15 PM, said:

I don't know though, a lot of people would stop watching when the Heisman winning running-back was James Whiteman who runs a 4.8




(noracist)


Every college sport besides football and basketball are played by nobodies.
For the most part.

#23
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View PostJoeGator, on 31 January 2014 - 10:17 PM, said:

Every college sport besides football and basketball are played by nobodies.
For the most part.

Do you know a ton of people that devote most of their free time scouring college gymnastics message boards? I ain't saying they should get paid but it's an interesting discussion. Schools are making straight $$$$ off of these kids.
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#24
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View PostTheRealBrave, on 31 January 2014 - 10:19 PM, said:

Do you know a ton of people that devote most of their free time scouring college gymnastics message boards? I ain't saying they should get paid but it's an interesting discussion. Schools are making straight $$$$ off of these kids.

I disagree.
The name on the jersey is what is making the money.
Fans hate players that don't give a Posted Image about the school.

High school football games can get 20,000. I see no reason why college football wouldn't continue to prosper.

#25
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View PostJoeGator, on 31 January 2014 - 10:29 PM, said:



I disagree.
The name on the jersey is what is making the money.
Fans hate players that don't give a Posted Image about the school.

High school football games can get 20,000. I see no reason why college football wouldn't continue to prosper.
You're on point.
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#26
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View PostShow Stopper, on 29 January 2014 - 08:51 PM, said:

While I do agree with their sentiments, I don't believe forming a union is the way to go.  I hope these people know that by joining a union, they will have to pay taxes on their tuition money since they will be designated as "employees".  Do they think the school is going to pay that for them?

If I had to bet, the IRS would treat it like they do academic scholarships where the only portion that taxes are owed on is that over and above the cost of tuition, books, room and board.  When I first started college I had enough academic scholarships I was getting $2k/semester back and I had to pay taxes on that as if it was normal income.  I got a 1099 from the school and everything.
I

View PostEaglefan, on 30 January 2014 - 06:51 AM, said:

Question I have would be if this were to happen would the school have to have insurance for the employees that they would be hiring to play football?? If so would that not be so freaking much money that it would be a moot point about making money for the school from the football program?

Pretty much every university falls into a category where they're self insured for liability and the like being either agents of the state or more available endowment money than some insurance companies.

View PostNoah, on 30 January 2014 - 09:46 AM, said:

There's a reality about college football that few folks are willing to explore.  It's not what the NCAA would lead you to believe.

That's the thing.  If nothing else, these guys are gonna press the point that from the University perspective, athletics is a business.

View PostHaymaker, on 30 January 2014 - 02:00 PM, said:

Eagle fan had it right...............if any move is made to "pay" players, then the schools should stop awarding football schollies and pay the players what the tuition would've cost

they'll figure out they're a buncha dumbasses who kicked a gift horse in the mouth then

To do that undermines every argument that's ever been made about "not a business" and "amateurism" that the NCAA has ever made.


View PostJoeGator, on 30 January 2014 - 02:23 PM, said:

How oblivious do you have to be to think you aren't replaceable?

People would still watch college sports even if these players weren't there.
Dumbasses.

The question is not whether there are other people out there who can play football.  The question is are there other people out there willing to play for just the cost of an education once someone points out the elephant in the room that there is in fact a huge money pie that the players COULD get a piece of.  For a comparison, with the world at large knowing how much the NFL rakes in, do you think you're going to find a bunch of replacement players there who will work for significantly less than the current players do?

As soon as college athletics started raking in the $ with TV deals and their own networks, etc etc it became a business and started undermining every argument the NCAA ever made about being amateur athletics for education.

And part of the reason Div I athletics pulls in the $ it does, is the quality of the play.  If suddenly the Div I product on the field looks like Div IIII, they're going to take a hit.  Big time.

Everybody gets up in arms about paying players, but at the end of the day, they're doing work for which the university gets millions.

I've made this comparison before.

When I was an undergrad, I got academic scholarships that covered my tuition, room and board.  I then worked for the university as an "amateur engineer" half time making $10/hour.  The whole world is ok with that.

When I was a grad student, I got a 95% tuition waiver, worked half time as a research assistant  and got a $15k/year stipend, again as an "amateur engineer".  The whole world is OK with that.

But the whole world flips out, when someone proposes paying over and above tuition, room, board for "amateur athletes" that work (practice) for the university 20 hours a week (plus games so actually more than 20 hours).

The only difference I can see between the two, is the athletes bring a whole lot more $ into the university than I ever did.

#27
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View Postnova, on 03 February 2014 - 09:48 AM, said:

The question is not whether there are other people out there who can play football.  The question is are there other people out there willing to play for just the cost of an education once someone points out the elephant in the room that there is in fact a huge money pie that the players COULD get a piece of.  For a comparison, with the world at large knowing how much the NFL rakes in, do you think you're going to find a bunch of replacement players there who will work for significantly less than the current players do?

As soon as college athletics started raking in the $ with TV deals and their own networks, etc etc it became a business and started undermining every argument the NCAA ever made about being amateur athletics for education.

And part of the reason Div I athletics pulls in the $ it does, is the quality of the play.  If suddenly the Div I product on the field looks like Div IIII, they're going to take a hit.  Big time.

Everybody gets up in arms about paying players, but at the end of the day, they're doing work for which the university gets millions.

I've made this comparison before.

When I was an undergrad, I got academic scholarships that covered my tuition, room and board.  I then worked for the university as an "amateur engineer" half time making $10/hour.  The whole world is ok with that.

When I was a grad student, I got a 95% tuition waiver, worked half time as a research assistant  and got a $15k/year stipend, again as an "amateur engineer".  The whole world is OK with that.

But the whole world flips out, when someone proposes paying over and above tuition, room, board for "amateur athletes" that work (practice) for the university 20 hours a week (plus games so actually more than 20 hours).

The only difference I can see between the two, is the athletes bring a whole lot more $ into the university than I ever did.

Paying amateur athletes means they aren't amateurs.
My problem with it is as simple as that.
I don't like professional sports at all because those players are loyal to their boss and paycheck, not the organization.

The entire thing is a total turn off for me because no one speaking out gives a flying :lanekiffin: that these players are getting the best dorm rooms on campus, free and better food than any of the normal students, free tutors for every class imaginable, free clothes and shoes, and an entirely free 4-5 year education.

The entire country bitches and moans about how unaffordable higher education is, but these guys want to cash in while they can because they are too lazy and Posted Imagety to be grateful and take advantage of the opportunity at hand.

Maybe I missed it, but I don't see Bill Gates' employees throwing bitch fits over being undervalued and how mean ol Bill is keeping all those billions for himself.




I will say that I don't mind minor stipends for every season or semester, but it pisses me off knowing that it will be spent on tattoos, liquor, and jewelry instead of food, gas, etc.
This whole outrage is because players want a higher standard of living while they are in school.

Edited by JoeGator, 03 February 2014 - 10:45 AM.


#28
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View PostJoeGator, on 03 February 2014 - 09:59 AM, said:

Paying amateur athletes means they aren't amateurs.
My problem with it is as simple as that.
I don't like professional sports at all because those players are loyal to their boss and paycheck, not the organization.


Thing is you're already paying them, they're just paid with in kind benefits and not cash.  If Universities got audited by the IRS like a business, pretty much everything athletes get would be considered compensation equivalent to income and taxable.  Div III athletes without any scholarships are amateurs, Div I are not.

Just like in my example above, what's the difference between me and an athlete other than the athletes bring in far more $ to the unversity than I ever did?   I've asked that question to dozens of people and never gotten a satisfactory answer.  Most of the answers I've ever gotten boil down to "well this is the way we've always done it."

View PostJoeGator, on 03 February 2014 - 09:59 AM, said:

I don't like professional sports at all because those players are loyal to their boss and paycheck, not the organization.

So was I only loyal to the paycheck when I was getting paid for my efforts while in school?  I don't think so, I'm as true maroon as any other dawg....

#29
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View Postnova, on 03 February 2014 - 10:07 AM, said:

Thing is you're already paying them, they're just paid with in kind benefits and not cash.  If Universities got audited by the IRS like a business, pretty much everything athletes get would be considered compensation equivalent to income and taxable.  Div III athletes without any scholarships are amateurs, Div I are not.

Just like in my example above, what's the difference between me and an athlete other than the athletes bring in far more $ to the unversity than I ever did?   I've asked that question to dozens of people and never gotten a satisfactory answer.  Most of the answers I've ever gotten boil down to "well this is the way we've always done it."



So was I only loyal to the paycheck when I was getting paid for my efforts while in school?  I don't think so, I'm as true maroon as any other dawg....

The real problem here stems from how much money university athletic departments make, and now that everyone is suddenly aware, they want their piece.
Maybe we should do away with academic scholarships too, since they will be considered professional students by the IRS.

I didn't say there was a difference between your on-campus engineering job and an athletic scholarship.
You can be true to your school just like any other dawg because you're NOT going to the highest bidder, because you aren't worth all that much to an organization that large.

This is how the world functions.
People at the top always reap the majority of the benefits.
Players need to learn to deal with it unless they would prefer to hurt their draft status by not playing in college at all.

#30
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My problem is that players are ungrateful for the opportunites they are given.

But hey, this is what happens when you suck their dick their entire lives and hero worship 16 year olds.

They don't care if they ruin college athletics forever, as long as they get that money.

Edited by JoeGator, 03 February 2014 - 10:48 AM.





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