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Star Wars Stand Alone Films

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129 replies to this topic

#121
HobnailedBoots

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View PostTheRealBrave, on 16 February 2013 - 09:16 PM, said:

Going to have to simply disagree with you there. It's a masterpiece and there is much more to the characters than you think in LOTR. There are plenty of grey area characters.

Name one.

#122
TheRealBrave

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View PostHobnailedBoots, on 16 February 2013 - 09:17 PM, said:

Name one.

Boromir, Denethor and Gollum for starters.
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#123
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View PostHobnailedBoots, on 16 February 2013 - 09:17 PM, said:

It's not even close. The plot is simplistic in LOTR. Yes, it's very detailed and vivid in it's imagery,  but there's only two sides - good and evil, and not much left in between. The Hobbit was a children's book anyway. LOTR was written with an older audience in mind, but it was still bound by the black and white nature of The Hobbit.

ASOIAF goes into much more depth and character development, and the imagery is close to if not equal to that of LOTR. There is no "good and evil," there are only shades of gray... it's much harder to determine who is "good." The dynamics of the story are such that the end is uncertain whereas in LOTR the end is clear from the very beginning - Frodo will carry the ring to Mordor and destroy it, thus defeating the forces of evil. Readers of ASOIAF still do not know how it ends, which adds to the anticipation in the reading experience.

now if only you had spelled "grey" correctly )= but yeah, I agree.
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#124
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View PostTheRealBrave, on 16 February 2013 - 09:18 PM, said:

Boromir, Denethor and Gollum for starters.
gollum was evil, smeagle was good...2 sides warring. no grey.
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#125
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View PostPenguin, on 16 February 2013 - 09:19 PM, said:

gollum was evil, smeagle was good...2 sides warring. no grey.

Ehh, a little bit. The movies portrayed it that way, for sure. He was a bit less of a schizo character in the novels IMO
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#126
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View PostTheRealBrave, on 16 February 2013 - 09:21 PM, said:

Ehh, a little bit. The movies portrayed it that way, for sure. He was a bit less of a schizo character in the novels IMO
but it was still obvious.
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#127
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View PostTheRealBrave, on 16 February 2013 - 09:18 PM, said:

Boromir, Denethor and Gollum for starters.

There's nothing grey about Boromir, he's a good guy who is seduced by the evil in the ring and then redeems himself through sacrifice. He himself wasn't "in the middle," he was a victim of the ring's power. Same thing goes for Gollum, except that he never broke free from it. Denethor is a good guy, despite his portrayal in the film.

Every "grey area" character in LOTR is under the power of the ring - an evil force.

In ASOIAF, almost everyone is "grey." And they're not so because they're being controlled by some force of evil, they act in self-interest.

#128
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View PostHobnailedBoots, on 16 February 2013 - 09:34 PM, said:

There's nothing grey about Boromir, he's a good guy who is seduced by the evil in the ring and then redeems himself through sacrifice. He himself wasn't "in the middle," he was a victim of the ring's power. Same thing goes for Gollum, except that he never broke free from it. Denethor is a good guy, despite his portrayal in the film.

Every "grey area" character in LOTR is under the power of the ring - an evil force.

In ASOIAF, almost everyone is "grey." And they're not so because they're being controlled by some force of evil, they act in self-interest.

they act in self interest sometimes, see the dwarf...half the time he's ruthless, half the time he's kind I identify with him well personality wise, although I'm better looking.
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#129
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If you truly want to think about it like this: Galadriel is a gray character. She was a leader of the Noldor who rebelled against the Valar when they left Valinor. It was only after the events in LOTR that she was allowed to return. While she was never in league with Sauron, she had no real reason to aid the fellowship in Lorien, either. She was, after all, after she passed her test, going to leave. The blue wizards, though not much is known about them, are gray, not to mention the ghost army or the Haradrim who only serve Sauron out of fear.

Edited by 1dawgfan09, 16 February 2013 - 09:42 PM.

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#130
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And as far as Smeagol being good, that is debatable. If Smeagol had been truly good, the ring wouldn't have worked on him as quickly as it did. I give you Bilbo and how long he kept it without it doing to him what it did to Smeagol almost instantly. The Ring is, after all, a psychic amplifier of sorts, bringing out the only barely concealed nasty traits just below the surface.
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